Salvation: 1 The Formula

Man, Sin, & Salvation
kenblogton
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Salvation: 1 The Formula

Post by kenblogton » Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:06 am

The Salvation Formula. In Acts 4:12, Peter says “Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name [than Jesus] under heaven given to men by which we must be saved.” In Romans 10, Paul says “That if you confess with your mouth ‘Jesus is Lord,’ and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.” (9) and “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.” (13). The inconsistent interpretation of these verses, in isolation from the rest of Scripture, is that all who do not accept Jesus Christ as their personal saviour are unsaved and condemned to hell; only those who have accepted Jesus Christ as their personal saviour are saved and go to heaven. For instance, Charles Stanley: In Touch magazine (January 2008), states “Only those who have received Jesus Christ as their savior will enter heaven.” In Phillip Cary’s review of J. D. Greear’s Stop Asking Jesus Into Your Heart: How to Know for Sure You Are Saved (Cary, P. 2013. “Anxious About Assurance.” A review of J. D. Greear’s Stop Asking Jesus Into Your Heart: How to Know for Sure You Are Saved (B&H Books, 2013) Christianity Today, 2013, March, 53-55), he states (54) “This [Faith that Perseveres] is an important matter, as Greear emphasizes by rejecting the perverse new version of the doctrine of eternal security, according to which salvation is a moment of decision that compels God to save you even if you later abandon the Christian faith altogether. Here Greear affirms, with the Calvinist tradition, that true saving faith is necessarily a faith that perseveres.” Here’s how the Bible describes persevering faith.
The same Paul who spoke Romans 10:9-13 states in Acts 20:21 (emphasis added) “I have declared to both Jews and Greeks that they must turn to God in repentance and have faith in our Lord Jesus.” and in Acts 26:20 (emphasis added) “First to those in Damascus, then to those in Jerusalem and in all Judea, and then to the Gentiles, I preached that they should repent and turn to God and demonstrate their repentance by their deeds.” The same Peter who spoke Acts 4:12 says in 2 Peter 3:9 (emphasis added) “The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. Instead he is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.” Luke 3:7-8 (emphasis added) quotes John the Baptist “John said to the crowds coming out to be baptized by him, “You brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the coming wrath? Produce fruit in keeping with repentance.” Jesus Himself states that repentance is essential to salvation in Luke 13:1-9, and in John 5:28-29 warns that those who do evil and do not do good will receive condemnation after death. Ongoing confession and repentance manifested in a life of inspired loving obedience is solid evidence of persevering faith! However, this does not deal with infants.
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Paidion
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Re: Salvation: 1 The Formula

Post by Paidion » Wed Oct 09, 2013 1:17 pm

There is nothing in the entire Bible about "accepting Christ as your personal Saviour". This is man's interpretation of the "method" of being saved from hell. But hell is not that from which we are primarily saved. We are being saved from SIN until the good work which has been done in us is brought to completion at the day of Jesus Christ. (Philippians 1:6)

In Jesus' day, one had to forsake all that he had in order to be His disciple. This is still the case today. After the Holy Spirit of Christ was given, Peter's gospel message was:

Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forsaking of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the holy spirit. (Acts 2:38)

To "repent" is to have a change of heart and mind concering the way we are living and behaving.

As I see it, George MacDonald (1824-1905) expressed the true way of salvation:

A Condensation of “Salvation from Sin”
Which is Chapter 1 of The Hope of the Gospel
by George MacDonald


The wrong, the evil that is in a man; he must be set free from it. I do not mean set free from the sins he has done: that will follow; I mean the sins he is doing, or is capable of doing; the sins in his being which spoil his nature, the wrongness in him, the evil he consents to; the sin he is, which makes him do the sin he does.

He will want only to be rid of his suffering; but that he cannot have, unless he is delivered from its essential root, a thing infinitely worse than any suffering it can produce. If he will not have that deliverance, he must keep his suffering. Through chastisement he will take at last the only way that leads to liberty. There can be no deliverance but to come out of his evil dream into the glory of God.

The Lord never came to deliver men from the consequences of their sins while those sins remained. That would be to throw the medicine out the window while the man still lies sick! That would be to come directly against the very laws of existence! Yet men, loving their sins, and feeling nothing of their dread hatefulness, have (consistently with their low condition) constantly taken this word concerning the Lord to mean that he came to save them from the punishment of their sins. This idea (this miserable fancy rather) has terribly corrupted the preaching of the gospel. The message of the good news has not been truly delivered.

He came to work along with our punishment. He came to side with it, and set us free from our sins. No man is safe from hell until he is free from his sins.

Not for any or all of his sins that are past shall a man be condemned; not for the worst of them does he need to fear remaining unforgiven. The sin in which he dwells, the sin of which he will not come out. That sin is the sole ruin of a man. His present live sins, those sins pervading his thoughts and ruling his conduct; the sins he keeps doing, and will not give up; the sins he is called to abandon, but to which he clings instead, the same sins which are the cause of his misery, though he may not know it --- these are the sins for which he is even now condemned.

It is the indwelling badness, ready to produce bad actions, from which we need to be delivered. If a man will not strive against this badness, he is left to commit evil and reap the consequences. To be saved from these consequences, would be no deliverance; it would be an immediate, ever deepening damnation. It is the evil in our being (no essential part of it, thank God!) from which He came to deliver us --- not the things we have done, but the possibility of doing such things anymore.
As this possibility departs, and we confess to those we have wronged, the power over us of our evil deeds will depart also, and so shall we be saved from them. The bad that lives in us, our evil judgments, our unjust desires, our hate and pride and envy and greed and self-satisfaction ---- these are the souls of our sins, our live sins, more terrible than the bodies of our sins, that is, the deeds we do, because they not only produce these loathsome characteristics, but they make us just as loathsome. Our wrong deeds are our dead works; our evil thoughts are our live sins. These sins, the essential opposites of faith and love, these sins that dwell in us and work in us, are the sins from which Jesus came to deliver us. When we turn against them and refuse to obey them, they rise in fierce insistence, but at the same time begin to die. We are then on the Lord's side, and He begins to deliver us from them.

From such, as from all other sins, Jesus was born to deliver us; not only, or even primarily, from the punishment of any of them. When all are gone, the holy punishment will have departed also. He came to make us good, and therein blessed children.

Evil is not human; it is the defect and opposite of human; but the suffering that follows it is human, belonging of necessity to the human that has sinned. While evil is the cause of sin, suffering is FOR the sinner, that he may be delivered from his sin.

A man may recognize the evil in him only as pain. He may know little and care nothing about his sins. Yet the Lord is sorry for his pain. He cries aloud, “Come to me all you who labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.” He opens His arms to all weary enough to come to Him in the hope of rest.

I certainly do not disregard understanding. The New Testament is full of urgings to understand. Our whole life must be a growth in understanding. But I cry out about the misunderstanding that comes of man's endeavour to understand while not obeying. Upon obedience our energy must be spent; understanding will follow. The Lord cannot save a man from his sins while he still holds to his sins.

If a man wants to be delivered from the evil in him, he must himself begin to cast it out, himself begin to disobey it, and work righteousness, and the man should look for and expect the help of his Father in this endeavour. Alone he could labour to all eternity and not succeed. He who has not made himself, cannot set himself right without Him who made him. But his maker is in him, and is his strength.

The sum of the matter is this: ---The Son has come from the Father to set the children free from their sins. The children must hear and obey Him, that He may send forth judgment unto victory.
Paidion

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jeremiah
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Re: Salvation: 1 The Formula

Post by jeremiah » Wed Oct 09, 2013 2:59 pm

Upon obedience our energy must be spent; understanding will follow. The Lord cannot save a man from his sins while he still holds to his sins.
Pish posh, what's this business of "our energy must be spent.."? Sounds like he's preaching 'works righteousness'. What a....

Just kidding, thanks for posting this Paidion, G. MacDonald explains it quite well. I was wondering if I'd see you chime in on this thread.
I certainly do not disregard understanding. The New Testament is full of urgings to understand. Our whole life must be a growth in understanding. But I cry out about the misunderstanding that comes of man's endeavour to understand while not obeying
Beautiful.

Grace and peace to you all.
Also unto thee, O Lord, belongeth mercy: for thou renderest to every man according to his work.

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Paidion
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Re: Salvation: 1 The Formula

Post by Paidion » Wed Oct 09, 2013 5:38 pm

Jeremiah wrote:Pish posh, what's this business of "our energy must be spent.."? Sounds like he's preaching 'works righteousness'. What a....
Just kidding, thanks for posting this Paidion, G. MacDonald explains it quite well.
Yes, you're just kidding, Jeremiah, but thousands out there think exactly that way. If we recognize that God requires anything of us at all beyond "getting saved", then we're "trying to get to heaven by our works." Their system of "faith righteousness" implies that Christ's righteousness is imputed to us in such a way that when God looks at us He doesn't see our sin but Christ's righteousness. God is somehow blinded to our sin because of "the robe of righteousness" with which we are clothed. We can't "get to heaven" by actual righteousness, but by "positional righteousness". However, some of them think it's a good idea (but unnecessary) to be actually righteous too. They call this "sanctification" and separate it from salvation. They consider that we are "saved" (from hell) by a single act of "accepting Christ as our personal Saviour". They do not understand that salvation FROM SIN is a process throughout our lives. They ask, "Just how many good works do you have to do, in order to get to heaven?" They just don't understand about being set free from sin. They think it's all about being saved from hell, and that our actions have nothing to do with it.

Thank God, He knows everything about us. In no way is He blinded to our sin. He is not interested in our having "positional righteousness". He wants us to have actual righteousness. He is aware of every selfish, sinful act (which hurts others as well as ourselves). His loving desire is to free us from bondage to sin.
Last edited by Paidion on Sat Oct 12, 2013 2:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Paidion

Man judges a person by his past deeds, and administers penalties for his wrongdoing. God judges a person by his present character, and disciplines him that he may become righteous.

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kenblogton
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Re: Salvation: 1 The Formula

Post by kenblogton » Sat Oct 12, 2013 12:28 pm

Reply to Paidion:
I'm pleased to see we seem to be in agreement regarding salvation. I speak of salvation's requirements in more detail in part 3. In my researching of the salvation formula's origins, here's what I've come up with: Al Hsu points out in his April 2008 Christianity Today article (66), “A Multifaceted Gospel,” “The formula of ‘accepting Jesus as your personal Lord and Savior’ is also fairly recent.” It dates back to the eighteenth century revival movement. The earliest reference I’ve found is Peter Clark of Salem Village’s February 13, 1734 Boston lecture “A Sinner’s Prayer for Converting Grace, or, The Necessity and Efficacy of the Grace of God in the Conversion of a Sinner,” published in Boston by S. Kneeland and T. Green in 1735. This was the time of the “Great Awakening” in America, the revival inaugurated by Jonathan Edwards.
In his September 22, 1989 Christianity Today article “History Repeats Itself” (22), Dr. James Innell Packer states “The view that saving faith is no more than ‘belief of the truth about Christ’s atoning death’ is not new.” He contends it goes back to the mid-eighteenth century and the Scot Robert Sandeman. Demons believe in the truth of God (James 2:19), and that certainly does not save them. It is a fact that Christ died for the sins of all humankind. Acceptance of this truth does not save a person, just as denial of it does not change its reality. To give this truth intellectual assent no more provides salvation than belief that Columbus discovered the Americas in 1492 gives one property rights in the Western Hemisphere.
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dseusy
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Re: Salvation: 1 The Formula

Post by dseusy » Fri Nov 08, 2013 5:09 pm

Kenblogton wrote:
Acceptance of this truth does not save a person
Kenblogton,

How do you interpret these:

"Then they said to Him, 'What shall we do, that we may work the works of God?' Jesus answered and said to them, 'This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent.'" John 6:28-29

"For Moses writes about the righteousness which is of the law, 'The man who does those things shall live by them.' But the righteousness of faith speaks in this way, 'Do not say in your heart, "Who will ascend into heaven?" (that is, to bring Christ down from above) or, "Who will descend into the abyss?" (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead). But what does it say? "The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart" (that is, the word of faith which we preach): that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.'" Romans 10:5-10

What about the man next to Jesus on the cross? What righteousness did he bring to the table that he might be with Jesus in paradise?

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Re: Salvation: 1 The Formula

Post by Paidion » Fri Nov 08, 2013 8:13 pm

I'm sure Ken will provide good explanations of these passages, dseucy. Meanwhile, if you don't mind, I would like to share my understanding of them.
"Then they said to Him, 'What shall we do, that we may work the works of God?' Jesus answered and said to them, 'This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent.'" John 6:28-29
Dseucy, how do YOU understand "believe in Him whom He sent? What does it mean to "believe in Jesus"? Does it mean to believe in His existence? Believe in His message? Believe that his death covered our sins so that we could go to heaven instead of hell?

The same word "πιστευω" that is translated "believe" in the above passage is translated as "entrust" in the following one:

Now when he was in Jerusalem at the Passover Feast, many believed in his name when they saw the signs that he was doing. But Jesus on his part did not entrust himself to them, because he knew all people (John 2:23,24 ESV)

Also "believe in Him" is actually "believe INTO Him" ("εις"="into" in the Greek). I think the idea again is "entrust oneself to Him". And to entrust oneself to someone's name is the same thing as entrusting oneself to that person. Now notice the contrast in the above passage if we translate the first sentence in this way:

Now when he was in Jerusalem at the Passover Feast, many entrusted themselves to his name when they saw the signs that he was doing. But Jesus on his part did not entrust himself to them, because he knew all people (John 2:23,24)

Many at the Passover Feast entrusted themselves to Jesus when they saw the miracles that he was performing, but He didn't entrust Himself to them! He knew what was in them. It was only because of the miracles that they entrusted themselves.

Jesus will begin the process of saving us from our sins when we entrust ourselves to Him!
"For Moses writes about the righteousness which is of the law, 'The man who does those things shall live by them.' But the righteousness of faith speaks in this way, 'Do not say in your heart, "Who will ascend into heaven?" (that is, to bring Christ down from above) or, "Who will descend into the abyss?" (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead). But what does it say? "The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart" (that is, the word of faith which we preach): that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.'" Romans 10:5-10
Notice the word "unto". "For with the heart one believes unto righteousness." Righteousness is the goal, but it is not the instantaneous result. And if we confess the Lord Jesus, the process of salvation from sin will begin, and will ultimately become a reality. It is not that by "trying to be good", we "earn God's favour" or "deserve heaven" because of our good works (as "false grace" teachers think true disciples are trying to do.) Rather God's enabling grace made available through the death of Christ begins to work in them so there is a transformation of their character begins to take place. "He who began a good work in you will bring it to completion in the day of Jesus Christ."
What about the man next to Jesus on the cross? What righteousness did he bring to the table that he might be with Jesus in paradise?
He bore witness to the other thief. Not in order to "be with Jesus in paradise", but just to express reality to the other thief who challenged Jesus' deity. Jesus understood this witness's heart; He understood that he had entrusted himself to Him.
Paidion

Man judges a person by his past deeds, and administers penalties for his wrongdoing. God judges a person by his present character, and disciplines him that he may become righteous.

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Re: Salvation: 1 The Formula

Post by Singalphile » Sat Nov 09, 2013 10:29 am

Paidion wrote:He bore witness to the other thief. Not in order to "be with Jesus in paradise", but just to express reality to the other thief who challenged Jesus' deity. Jesus understood this witness's heart; He understood that he had entrusted himself to Him.
I never thought about that. He is also an encouragement, example, and blessing to millions of us since, though he couldn't have known it! Neat. :)
... that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father. John 5:23

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Re: Salvation: 1 The Formula

Post by Homer » Sun Nov 10, 2013 12:07 am

John 5:24, New American Standard Bible (NASB)

24. “Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of (ek) death into (eis) life.


Jesus' emphatic statement ("truly, truly") should make it plain how we become saved: by grace and not works. The works are evidentiary as Jesus says:

Matthew 7:15-20, New American Standard Bible (NASB)

15. “Beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves. 16. You will know them by their fruits. Grapes are not gathered from thorn bushes nor figs from thistles, are they? 17. So every good tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears bad fruit. 18. A good tree cannot produce bad fruit, nor can a bad tree produce good fruit. 19. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 So then, you will know them by their fruits.


Obviously, we do not become part of the grapevine by producing grapes. We produce fruit because we are part of the vine. But if we are not producing any fruit at all, we show ourselves to be a dead branch, soon to be cut off and, ultimately, destroyed.

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Re: Salvation: 1 The Formula

Post by Paidion » Sun Nov 10, 2013 3:17 pm

Homer wrote:John 5:24, New American Standard Bible (NASB)

24. “Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of (ek) death into (eis) life.


Jesus' emphatic statement ("truly, truly") should make it plain how we become saved: by grace and not works.
Homer, you are attacking a straw man. I don't know of a single person who posts to this forum who believes we are saved through good works (that is self-effort in working righteousness).

I wrote what I did to indicate that we do not get right with God by believing in the existence of Christ, or His work on the cross, but by entrusting ourselves to Him, and submitting ourselves to Him. There is no belief in any doctrine which will save us!
Homer wrote:The works are evidentiary as Jesus says...

Matthew 7:15-20, New American Standard Bible (NASB)

15. “Beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves. 16. You will know them by their fruits. Grapes are not gathered from thorn bushes nor figs from thistles, are they? 17. So every good tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears bad fruit. 18. A good tree cannot produce bad fruit, nor can a bad tree produce good fruit. 19. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 So then, you will know them by their fruits.


In your quote above Jesus said, "Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire." So though we are not saved from the fire by good works, Jesus instructs us here that it is necessary to bear good fruit (good works? the fruit of the spirit?) or we will be thrown into the fire.

Back to the first quote:

“Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes in Him who sent Me, has eternal life."

What does "hearing Christ's word" mean? Does it mean only listening to it with our ears? NO. It means to listen and to obey. Even in our day, when we say, "I told my son what to do, but he didn't listen", we mean that he didn't obey.

And the Greek indicates "believing IN Him who sent me" not "believe Him who sent Me, since "Him" in the dative case in Greek. Again, I think that means entrusting ourselves to the Father (as well as the Son).

If anyone thinks gaining" eternal" life has nothing to do with works, he would do well to consider carefully Romans 2:6-10

For He will render to everyone according to his works. To those who by perseverance in well-doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, He will give lasting life, but for those who are self-seeking and are not persuaded by the truth, but are persuaded by unrighteousness, there will be wrath and fury. Affliction and anguish for every person who does evil, ... but glory and honour and well-being for every one who does good ... for God shows no partiality.
Paidion

Man judges a person by his past deeds, and administers penalties for his wrongdoing. God judges a person by his present character, and disciplines him that he may become righteous.

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