List of Millenial Passages Fulfilled - Quoted by disciples

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Gregorio
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List of Millenial Passages Fulfilled - Quoted by disciples

Post by Gregorio » Wed Jan 23, 2013 12:10 pm

Does anyone have or know of a simple list, without to much extra commentary on the Millenial(Kingdom)Passages in the OT that the disciples quote as fulfilled in the NT?

dwilkins
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Re: List of Millenial Passages Fulfilled - Quoted by disciples

Post by dwilkins » Wed Jan 23, 2013 3:52 pm

Those passages would be tough to come by because the term Millennium isn't used in the Old Testament (or for that matter a generic phrase like "reign for 1,000 years"). So, these would all be indirect or implicit references to Rev. 20:4-6, which will almost certainly make them controversial. Maybe it will help to point out New Testament references to the 1,000 years possibly being fulfilled in the time of the disciples:

4 Then I saw thrones, and seated on them were those to whom the authority to judge was committed. Also I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. 5 The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended. This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy is the one who shares in the first resurrection! Over such the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ, and they will reign with him for a thousand years.

So, we are looking for passages that talk about:

1) People are on thrones who've been given authority to judge
2) Martyrs participating in the reign of Christ from heaven.


In the first case, you might see evidence of this in the following verses:

Eph. 2:4-6

4 But[c] God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, 5 even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved— 6 and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus,

Matt. 11:28

28 Jesus said to them, “Truly, I say to you, in the new world, when the Son of Man will sit on his glorious throne, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

In the second case, you might see evidence of this in the following verses:

Rev. 6:9-11

9 When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the witness they had borne. 10 They cried out with a loud voice, “O Sovereign Lord, holy and true, how long before you will judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?” 11 Then they were each given a white robe and told to rest a little longer, until the number of their fellow servants[c] and their brothers[d] should be complete, who were to be killed as they themselves had been.

That's a start. I'm sure others will have more detailed answers.

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Paidion
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Re: List of Millenial Passages Fulfilled - Quoted by disciples

Post by Paidion » Wed Jan 23, 2013 4:52 pm

Second century Christians seemed to believe that the millenium was future to their time, and that it would be followed by final judgment.
Justin Martyr (110-165 A.D.) wrote:I and others, who are right-minded Christians on all points, are assured that there will be a resurrection of the dead, and a thousand years in Jerusalem, which will then be built, adorned, and enlarged, the prophets Ezekiel and Isaiah and others declare.

For Isaiah spake thus concerning this space of a thousand years: 'For there shall be the new heaven and the new earth, and the former shall not be remembered, or come into their heart; but they shall find joy and gladness in it, which things I create. For, Behold, I make Jerusalem a rejoicing, and My people a joy; and I shall rejoice over Jerusalem, and be glad over My I people. And the voice of weeping shall be no more heard in her, or the voice of crying. And there shall be no more there a person of immature years, or an old man who shall not fulfil his days. For the young man shall be an hundred years old; but the sinner who dies an hundred years old, he shall be accursed. And they shall build houses, and shall themselves inhabit them; and they shall plant vines, and shall themselves eat the produce of them, and drink the wine. They shall not build, and others inhabit; they shall not plant, and others eat. For according to the days of the tree shall be the days of my people; the works of their toil shall abound. Mine elect shall not toil fruitlessly, or beget children to be cursed; for they shall be a seed righteous and blessed by the Lord, and their offspring with them. And it shall come to pass, that before they call I will hear; while they are still speaking, I shall say, What is it? Then shall the wolves and the lambs feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the ox; but the serpent[shall eat] earth as bread. They shall not hurt or maltreat each other on the holy mountain, i saith the Lord.' Now we have understood that the expression used among these words, 'According to the days of the tree[of life] shall be the days of my people; the works of their toil shall abound' obscurely predicts a thousand years. For as Adam was told that in the nay fie ate of the tree he would die, we know that he did not complete a thousand years. We have perceived, moreover, that the expression, 'The day of the Lord is as a thousand years,' is connected with this subject. And further, there was a certain man with us, whose name was John, one of the apostles of Christ, who prophesied, by a revelation that was made to him, that those who believed in our Christ would dwell a thousand years in Jerusalem; and that thereafter the general, and, in short, the eternal resurrection and judgment of all men would likewise take place. Just as our Lord also said, 'They shall neither marry nor be given in marriage, but shall be equal to the angels, the children of the God of the resurrection.'
—Dialogue With Trypho, last sentence of ch.80, and all of ch.81

I know some argue against it, but to me, Irenæus (120-202 A.D.) affirmed that John saw the apocalyptic vision by which he wrote the book of Revelation, during Domitian's reign. That would have been a long time after the days of the apostles (and also 20 years or more after 70 A.D.):
Irenæus wrote:We will not, however, incur the risk of pronouncing positively as to the name of Antichrist; for if it were necessary that his name should be distinctly revealed in this present time, it would have been announced by him who beheld the apocalyptic vision. For that was seen no very long time since, but almost in our day, towards the end of Domitian's reign.
— Against Heresies, Book V, Ch.30, Sec 3

He also indicates that the coming of Antichrist is future to his day and he would reign 3½ years, and that his reign would be followed by "the times of the kingdom", "the seventh day." It was believed that just as there were 7 days of creation, so there would be 7 thousand years on earth, the last thousand being the fullness of Christ's Kingdom on earth.
Irenæus wrote:But he indicates the number of the name now, that when this man comes we may avoid him, being aware who he is: the name, however, is suppressed, because it is not worthy of being proclaimed by the Holy Spirit. For if it had been declared by Him, he (Antichrist) might perhaps continue for a long period. But now as "he was, and is not, and shall ascend out of the abyss, and goes into perdition," as one who has no existence; so neither has his name been declared, for the name of that which does not exist is not proclaimed. But when this Antichrist shall have devastated all things in this world, he will reign for three years and six months, and sit in the temple at Jerusalem; and then the Lord will come from heaven in the clouds, in the glory of the Father, sending this man and those who follow him into the lake of fire; but bringing in for the righteous the times of the kingdom, that is, the rest, the hallowed seventh day; and restoring to Abraham the promised inheritance, in which kingdom the Lord declared, that "many coming from the east and from the west should sit down with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob."
Paidion

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dwilkins
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Re: List of Millenial Passages Fulfilled - Quoted by disciples

Post by dwilkins » Wed Jan 23, 2013 4:59 pm

Justin Martyr and Irenaeus were chiliasts, a position considered at least an error and at worst heresy in the early church.

Doug

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Paidion
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Re: List of Millenial Passages Fulfilled - Quoted by disciples

Post by Paidion » Wed Jan 23, 2013 5:04 pm

How early?
Paidion

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dwilkins
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Re: List of Millenial Passages Fulfilled - Quoted by disciples

Post by dwilkins » Wed Jan 23, 2013 6:14 pm

In the first generation. The Apostle John is reported as criticizing Cerinthus in his own generation for advocating chiliasm. None of the first wave of ANF writings reflect chiliasm. As the Judaizers were successful in advocating it in the 2nd Century chiliasm grew in the church. But, it wasn't an original conception and was eventually condemned in the Nicean Creed and then consistently in Augustinian theology. I don't tend to be a fan of Augustine, but chiliasm has never been the majority view of the church and was eventually condemned. For anyone not familiar with the topic, a simple Google search will help fill in the blanks.

Doug

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Paidion
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Re: List of Millenial Passages Fulfilled - Quoted by disciples

Post by Paidion » Wed Jan 23, 2013 7:28 pm

The apostle John didn't oppose Cerinthus for advocating chiliasm; he opposed him because Cerinthus was a gnostic. John probably had him in mind when he wrote I John, warning against those who denied Jesus as having come in the flesh. Indeed, if John was the author of Revelation, he taught "chiliasm".

The apostle Paul wrote against "Judaizers" in Galatians. However, I see no relationship between "Judaizing" and chiliasm. I think Justin Martyr and Irenæus well represented 2nd century Christian thinking. Unlike Cerinthus, neither of them was a gnostic OR a Judaizer.

You have yet to show that ANY first or second century Christian writer opposed the teaching that Jesus would reign on earth for 1000 years after His coming and before Judgment Day.
Paidion

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Re: List of Millenial Passages Fulfilled - Quoted by disciples

Post by Homer » Wed Jan 23, 2013 9:58 pm

Paidion,

Don't know if you are familiar with Tim Warner, but I think his view is similar to yours, but he calls chilaism "progressive dispensationalism". He has written a lot of stuff on eschatology. Here is a link to one of his articles and his concluding paragraph:

Origins of the Heavenly Destiny Concept
Greek Mysticism & Gnosticism
http://www.pfrs.org/pd/06.html

The "chilaism" (millennialism) of the early orthodox Christian Church knew nothing of a heavenly destiny for the Church distinct from God's program for Israel. The early Christians' hope was identical to that of the Patriarchs, the Prophets, and all the saints of Hebrews eleven, an inheritance in the coming physical Kingdom of God on earth. The Church was seen as all of the redeemed from every dispensation. While most may not be aware of this, progressive dispensationalism is largely a return to the basic pre-millennialism of the early orthodox Church. Darby threw off some of the Augustinian thinking predominant in Protestantism, particularly where it concerns the nation of Israel. But, it is my personal belief that he did not go far enough, and continued to entertain 'mystical' thinking regarding the Church, begun by the Gnostics, toned down by Origen, and made mainstream by Augustine. Darby should have gone all the way back to Apostolic theology found in those who had personal linkage to Apostolic oral tradition, like Justin, Irenaeus, and Hippolytus. He should have abandoned the heavenly destiny idea of the Gnostics, Origen, and Augustine, and embraced the chilaism handed down to the second generation Christians by the Apostles. Instead, he fell into the same trap as the Gnostics 1500 years earlier, and imagined a dichotomy between the Old Testament program for Israel and the New Testament program for the Church.

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Re: List of Millenial Passages Fulfilled - Quoted by disciples

Post by dwilkins » Thu Jan 24, 2013 1:09 pm

Paidion,

I'm pressed for time, so I can't answer you in detail at this point. It is well known as far as I can tell that chiliasm came from Jewish eschatology (including Essenes) into Christianity. I think you should do some more reading on the subject. You might find Regnum Caelorum by Charles Hill useful:

http://www.amazon.com/Regnum-Caelorum-P ... m+caelorum



Gregorio,

As far as the original post goes, I think the difficulty in answering your question is some vagueness in what you are asking. There is no direct reference in the Old Testament to the 1,000 year reign. It would help to understand your question if I knew how you defined this reign (chiliasm, non-chiliasm, etc.), and what your understanding is of the New Heavens and New Earth.

Doug

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Gregorio
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Re: List of Millenial Passages Fulfilled - Quoted by disciples

Post by Gregorio » Thu Jan 24, 2013 4:41 pm

Hi guys thanks for the replys... to answer the last question... I do believe the 1000 years to be symbolic or maybe metaphoric(a good way to say this?) and that the old testament passages are the "kingdom passages".. I shouldn't have used the word Millenial in the original post... wonderful answers tho and thanks.. I am looking for kingdom passages quoted in scripture by the NT writers in a simple list. I did find Steve Greggs out there as a chart also.

Also another quick question while I have the attention of wise men... Would I be right in saying that in the New Testament...every time a writer says "So it fulfilled the prophet _____ where he said______" refers to a kingdom passage? Is every quote about Christ fulfilling the OT refering to a kingdom passage or as some refer to the (so called)Millenial passages?

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