So this whole UFO thing is starting to heat up...

Angels & Demons
__id_2622
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Post by __id_2622 » Wed Mar 19, 2008 3:56 pm

brody_in_ga wrote:
If there are UFOs, I would first suspect that they are somehow a tool of the devil(possibly demons) to deceive mankind into some kind of new age philosophy. That would be my first guess.
Check out this book:

Alien Encounters: The Secret Behind The Ufo Phenomenon - by Chuck Missler and Mark Eastman

It's written from a Christian standpoint and talks about exactly what you were thinking. In fact maybe you've already read this book?

TK wrote:
right, brody- what better way to explain the rapture?
I think it might touch on this also.

I read it a couple years ago. I don't recommend reading this book at night. It gave me the creeps anyway.

I don't know if this will help but the book reminds me of The Beautiful Side of Evil - by Johanna Michaelsen, which I haven't read but I've heard her tell her story on the radio.


Zoe
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_brody_in_ga
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Post by _brody_in_ga » Tue Mar 25, 2008 8:17 pm

MillerShull wrote:brody_in_ga wrote:
If there are UFOs, I would first suspect that they are somehow a tool of the devil(possibly demons) to deceive mankind into some kind of new age philosophy. That would be my first guess.
Check out this book:

Alien Encounters: The Secret Behind The Ufo Phenomenon - by Chuck Missler and Mark Eastman

It's written from a Christian standpoint and talks about exactly what you were thinking. In fact maybe you've already read this book?

TK wrote:
right, brody- what better way to explain the rapture?
I think it might touch on this also.

I read it a couple years ago. I don't recommend reading this book at night. It gave me the creeps anyway.

I don't know if this will help but the book reminds me of The Beautiful Side of Evil - by Johanna Michaelsen, which I haven't read but I've heard her tell her story on the radio.


Zoe
Thanks for the info. I watched a program on "UFO's and Roswell" the other night, it was creepy.
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_Sam McNear
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Post by _Sam McNear » Sun Apr 13, 2008 10:49 am

The Scriptures do not directly address the question of alien beings. The Bible does not explicitly confirm or deny the existence of intelligent life from other planets. Although the subject is not addressed explicitly, the Bible teaches implicitly that the only things He created with intelligence are the angels, man, and the animals.

It is important to remember that the stars and planets were not created billions of years before Earth. According to the Bible, Earth is not the result of billions of years of stellar evolution during which many other planets were created. Earth was created before any other planet or star existed. Earth came into existence on the first day of Creation (Genesis 1:1). God withheld the creation of the Sun, Moon and stars until the fourth day (Genesis 1:14-19). Earth is unique and holds center stage in God's Creation.

Furthermore, the Bible clearly indicates that the fate of the universe (every other planet and star) is forever linked to God's timetable for mankind and the Earth. One day, Christ will return to Earth and complete the final act of man's redemption (2 Peter 3:7-10). He will destroy this present universe and create a new heavens and Earth (2 Peter 3:7,10; Revelations 21:1). All the stars and planets will be destroyed, along with the Earth.

What bearing does this have on the question of extraterrestrial life? The timetable (and the whole reason) for this destruction and re-creation clearly seems to be based on God's plan for us Earthlings. If God had created intelligent life on other worlds, it is hard to imagine that their lives would be calibrated by the failures of Earth's inhabitants. It seems unlikely and unfair that their distant planets would be destroyed by God because of His plan for Earth. The implication of Scripture is that there are no other intelligent beings besides man, animals, and the angels.

Why will God destroy the planets and stars along with Earth? When Adam sinned, ALL of creation was affected—the entire universe. Romans 8:18-22 teaches that all “creation was subjected to futility.” Although we are all familiar with the fact that God made man the ruler of Earth (Genesis 1:28), Scripture suggests that even the heavens are subject to mankind.

“Thy heavens, the work of the Thy fingers, the moon and the stars, which Thou has ordained…Thou dost make him [man] to rule over the works of Thy hands, Thou has put all things under his feet” (Psalms 8:3,6).

“And take heed, lest you lift your eyes to heaven, and when you see the sun, the moon, and the stars, all the host of heaven, you feel driven to worship them and serve them, which the Lord your God has given to all the peoples under the whole heaven as a heritage” (Deuteronomy 4:19).

Practical experience suggests that nothing in the universe is probably in its more perfect, originally created state. Earth is certainly no longer the paradise described in Genesis. Stars are dying. The moon and planets have been pummeled. It seems that everything in the universe will eventually wear out.

Furthermore what about UFO's-
UFO’s have to be a spiritual thing due to the fact that it is physically, scientifically, impossible for a craft to move as fast as they do. Let me explain in mathematical, technical way that it is not feasible.

1. For a spacecraft to acquire a speed of c/10, the kinetic energy needed is given accurately enough by the non-relativistic formula of mv2. For a very small unmanned spacecraft of 10 kg, this is x 10 kg x (3 x 107 m/s)2 = 4.5 x 1015 J, or approximately the whole world's electricity production for a month.
For a manned spacecraft weighing several tons, the energy requirements would greatly exceed the world's annual electricity consumption. For the city-sized spacecraft in Independence Day, the energy requirements would be staggering. And when the spacecraft slowed again, it would use up to almost this amount of energy in braking.
If the spacecraft had to accelerate to c/10, slow down, and speed up many times, the energy needed would be many times greater.
It would probably be impossible for enough fuel to be carried without some sort of antimatter drive. If perfect annihilation—complete conversion of matter to energy (E=mc2)—where possible, 1 ton of antimatter could annihilate 1 ton of ordinary matter to produce: 2000 kg x (3 x 108 m/s)2, or 1.8 x 1020 J. And this is the absolute maximum amount of energy that could be produced from a given mass of fuel. A real spacecraft could be nowhere near this efficient.
2. The kinetic energy of a speck of dust with a mass of just 0.1 gram impacting at a tenth the speed of light, calculated from the spacecraft's reference frame, is mv2, or

x 10-4 kg x (3 x 107 m/s)2 = 4.5 x 1010 J.

3. The combustion energy of TNT is 4,520 kJ/kg, or 4.52 x 109 J/ton. So 4.5 x 1010 J is equivalent to 9.95 tons of TNT. Therefore, the impact energy of a 0.1 g object hitting a spacecraft traveling at c/10 would be equivalent to an explosion of about 10 tons of TNT.
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_Allyn
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Post by _Allyn » Sun Apr 13, 2008 12:05 pm

Thanks Sam, I appreciate your comments. It makes sense to me - excepth the physics part and I will just believe you on that. If UFOs are spiritual in nature (and I don't believe in space aliens) why do these spirits need some sort of craft? Maybe you can explain your thinking on that a little further.

I also think many observances that appear around the earth are manifestations from electrical bursts from deep within the crust of the earth. Some things are simply made up or otherwise explained away.

Any further thoughts?
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_Sam McNear
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Post by _Sam McNear » Sun Apr 13, 2008 5:58 pm

Great question, :D I don’t really know why they need crafts. But I ask this question, was the chariot of fire that separated Elisha and Elijah in 2Ki 2:11 “a craft”:?: How fast did it go :?: And what was the whirlwind that took Elijah to heaven :?: If we saw this today would we say a spaceship beamed Elijah up in to heaven :?: Take the most popular bible story for UFO enthusiasts in Ezekiel ch.1 . Is this a vision of spiritual things :?: Listen to Steve Gregg’s teaching on Ezekiel. http://thenarrowpath.com/mp3s/bible/ezekiel/eze1.mp3
So my question is, why can’t spiritual things have crafts :?: or craft looking things.
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_Allyn
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Post by _Allyn » Sun Apr 13, 2008 6:55 pm

why can’t spiritual things have crafts or craft looking things.
Makes me wonder where they would park them while, say, giving a vision to Daniel, or appearing to Mary to announce her motherhood, or while speaking to Abraham concerning Lot. Just seems to me there really is no need for some sort of craft to move from one realm to the next.

Could be wrong though. :roll:

I will listen to Steve's lecture. Thanks.
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