Advice for a struggling believer (hypothetical)

[Singalphile]

I generally concur with what has been written, but I would add this: I think we need to be a bit wary when dealing with those struggling with this issue and not (no matter how well meaning) use analogies regarding normative sexual impulses. The fact is, if we are single and have strong temptations, we do have a Scripturally allowable means of relieving it; it's called marriage. Homosexuals do not have this, at least not Scripturally. A sex drive is a natural thing. With gays, it's a skewed drive, but the desire for sexual expression itself is natural. So there's the conundrum.

I agree that the situations are dissimilar. As you mentioned, the homosexual drive is itself a skewed drive. I don't want to give the impression that it isn't.

However, I think it's true that non-married people (and some married people) are in fact all in the same boat regarding sexual temptation. Single people can't or don't just up and get married in 5 minutes or even 5 years.

I also agree with mattrose that the idea of sex and sexual attraction is over-rated in our culture. These things presumably didn't exist before God created the universe and apparently won't exist in the resurrection. The fact that I'll likely never have sex means about as much to me as the fact that I'll likely never travel to China. It's not like hunger, a drive that must be satisfied or it gets stronger. Just do something else and you forget all about it. How's that for advice?

[MMathis]

For those of you who don't think someone knows early. My 1st grade love was named Anita. If it had been named Brad, I would probably remember it.

I don't know why this is so hard for Christians to understand that they are wired that way from the get go.

People are born with lots of different disorders and we acknowledge them.

To live the lifestyle or not should be the only question at this point. The Bible speaks plenty on this.

While we (Christians) are arguing about the wrong things, the gay lobby is passing laws to make us comply with their wishes. Music awards programs and the Rose Parade come to mind. Great children programs, don'tcha think.

[mattrose]

For those of you who don't think someone knows early. My 1st grade love was named Anita. If it had been named Brad, I would probably remember it.

To be fair, the issue is not so black and white as you may be implying.

SOME people with same-sex attraction surely do experience such feelings early on in their lives
SOME people with same-sex attraction don't claim to have experienced such feelings until considerably later

And even if we take it for granted that some people experience it from very early on, that doesn't necessarily dictate that everyone in THAT category is experiencing those feelings for genetic reasons. By 5 years old, even, there are environmental factors at work to be sure.

Personally, though, I do not feel it is very important to contest the idea that some people have a genetic predisposition toward same-sex attraction. I just don't think all people with same-sex attraction fit into that category. It is essentially proven to be the case that some people with same-sex attraction have those feelings in reaction to something significant happening to them in the past.

[MMathis]

The statement was made that people couldn't know these things early at 5 or 6. That is incorrect.

Of course 100 percent of homosexuals are not exactly the same. I'm just saying that to say someone turned homosexual or learned the behavior is 99% of the time wrong.

They should not be treated unfairly, but nobody should. Same sex marriage should not be accepted, but it rapidly is. If you dare to act like you don't approve, you can kiss your career goodbye at most large employers or the military.

[mattrose]

I'm just saying that to say someone turned homosexual or learned the behavior is 99% of the time wrong.

I'm not sure how you can say that so dogmatically

[MMathis]

First of all you are only talking about a small fraction of people. They would have us believe 10% or more of the general population. I personally think it is less.

Secondly, having contact with many over the last 50 years, I can say it with confidence that I don't think I ever met any homosexuals that were turned into what they are. Entertainment and the hotel industry seems to have a more openly homosexual population than most.

All I'm saying is that if you approach it as trying to turn them back, you are way off track.

PS: Nevada just backed out of defending marriage between one man and one woman. Keep misunderstanding the problem and see where we end up.

[morbo3000]

Hi Schoel

I had a lengthy discussion in the following thread about how some Christians support their views on monogamous homosexual relationships. It might help to understand how those people approach the subject.

I want to respect Schoel's purpose for this thread so if anyone (or you, Schoel) would like to further discuss it, I'd rather keep it on that thread.

http://theos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=4390

[MMathis]

Hi morbo3000

Since you signed off on that thread I thought you were done.

It appears we were all wrong and the homosexual community has it correct.
As long as it is within a marriage it is okay. I guess that means we just need to
is approve of same sex marriage and everything will be fine.

We need to figure out how to do this will more sins. Change our definition of what
is going on and we can wipe out sin altogether.

[schoel]

While we (Christians) are arguing about the wrong things, the gay lobby is passing laws to make us comply with their wishes. Music awards programs and the Rose Parade come to mind. Great children programs, don'tcha think.
...
They should not be treated unfairly, but nobody should. Same sex marriage should not be accepted, but it rapidly is. If you dare to act like you don't approve, you can kiss your career goodbye at most large employers or the military.
...
PS: Nevada just backed out of defending marriage between one man and one woman. Keep misunderstanding the problem and see where we end up.

The "culture wars" approach that many Christians have been fighting doesn't strike me as the same battle that Jesus would be interested in. In my humble opinion, fighting same sex unions in the political arena has done nothing to further the Gospel, and much to destroy relational avenues for reaching the gay community for Christ.

The Kingdom of God is never furthered by violence, coercion or force, but by reaching individual hearts with the good news of the power of the cross. Let's stop using the world's tools and use God's instead.

Romans 12:21 - Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

John 18:36 - Jesus replied, “My kingdom is not from this world. If my kingdom were from this world, my servants would be fighting to keep me from being handed over to the Jewish authorities. But as it is, my kingdom is not from here.”

[MMathis]

So if we had just talked it over with the British we would not have had to shed blood to break away and have freedom of religion. That's great to know now. Japan would have come around and Hitler would of backed off if we would have just arranged to meet them for brunch.

Even God has warrior angels. Sorry I don't think we should just hand over everything without a fight. If you don't think we are under siege that is a different discussion. For every verse about non-violence the is probably an example of God assisting someone in defeating an enemy.

Didn't mean to get off the OP's subject. I'm done