What is happened to Israel is happening now to all the west:

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jpat1975
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What is happened to Israel is happening now to all the west:

Post by jpat1975 » Thu Aug 11, 2016 5:54 am

What is happened to Israel is happening now to all the west: a bogus refugee crisis

The patterns are disturbingly similar and the same games are being played..
... a repetition of the ongoing Palestinian refugee crisis, with the Arab states refusing to give jobs and citizenship to Palestinian Arabs over decades, keeping them in refugee camps and laying the blame on Israel. Is it surprising that the Arab world is still on the steady downward course it embarked on in 1948?
https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/6502 ... rab-states

I think this is satans way of setting up a global dictatorship directly (or in the aftermath of a failed) muslim caliphat. I see these so-called refugees as future "brown shirts".

Thoughts?

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Re: What is happened to Israel is happening now to all the w

Post by Paidion » Thu Aug 11, 2016 9:31 am

The vast majority of Syrian refugees are genuine refugees.
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Re: What is happened to Israel is happening now to all the w

Post by steve » Thu Aug 11, 2016 12:15 pm

...with the Arab states refusing to give jobs and citizenship to Palestinian Arabs...
I am not sure why it is thought that the Arab states should absorb the Palestinians, when most Palestinians would prefer to stay in the land possessed for 1,300 years by their ancestors (now modern Israel). True, if the Arab states were more philanthropic (which they probably should be), the Palestinians could migrate there—but why should they be required to do so?

If the Chinese should annex the United States, and would bulldoze my neighborhood, saying that I have to live in a refugee camp because I am not Chinese—or else I can move to another country where Western Europeans of my ethnicity dominate, does it seem a just thing that I should be given only these two choices? What if I like my home, my garden, my neighbors, etc., and would prefer to stay here?

The idea that the Arab states have an obligation to take in the Palestinians seems an overtly racist position. Palestinians are Arabs, and so are the states around them—but the former have not historically belonged to the latter. Do we assume that people of one race must live with others of their own race? What other justification can be suggested for expecting the Palestinians to give up their homes in Israel and move to other countries simply because that country is racially related to them. Is it an idea consistent with Christian thought that nations must be racially homogenous? Maybe someone could explain to me the rationale for this thinking.

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Re: What is happened to Israel is happening now to all the w

Post by steve7150 » Fri Aug 12, 2016 7:18 am

I am not sure why it is thought that the Arab states should absorb the Palestinians, when most Palestinians would prefer to stay in the land possessed for 1,300 years by their ancestors (now modern Israel). True, if the Arab states were more philanthropic (which they probably should be), the Palestinians could migrate there—but why should they be required to do so?




My understanding of Palestine is a bit different then the way you make it sound. For the 1,300 years it was owned by the Turks who are not Arabs. The Arabs who lived there were Bedouins who lived in tents and moved around like nomads and so didn't establish roots in any section. Palestine during this era was described in history by many writers including Mark Twain as being desolate. That's not to say that whoever lived there should lose that right. But as i understand it the Jews who migrated there bought the land they occupied and when the UN declared Israel a state it was immediately attacked by six Arab nations. These nations encouraged the Arabs living in Israel to leave and return after the Jews were destroyed.
The Arabs around Israel have made it quite clear they want to destroy Israel and it's occupants and the Palestinians elected a party called "Hamas" who include in their charter the destruction of Israel. Lastly my understanding is that the phrase "Palestinians" never existed until Yasser Arafat created it and that they are mostly Jordanians.

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Re: What is happened to Israel is happening now to all the w

Post by steve » Fri Aug 12, 2016 2:53 pm

Unfortunately, American Christians have been kept very much in the dark about the recent history of Israel, and many myths pervade our thinking. My research on this has been fairly extensive (though I am always seeking more and better information). Here are excerpts from my teaching notes on the "Modern State of Israel":

A. Myths and misunderstandings
The following six myths are widely held and repeated by pro-Zionists (including Christians). After each myth, I have provided quotations refuting the myth.

1. “A land without a people for a people without a land.” (Zionist political slogan)

“Zionism, be it right or wrong, good or bad, [is] rooted in age-long traditions, in present needs and future hopes of far profounder import than the desires and prejudices of the 700,000 Arabs who now inhabit that ancient land.”
—Lord James Balfour, writing in 1922 (cited by Martin Bunton, The Palestinian-Israeli Conflict…, 19-20

"We came to this country which was already populated by Arabs, and we are establishing a Hebrew, that is a Jewish, state here...Jewish villages were built in the place of Arab villages...There is not a single community in the country that did not have a former Arab population."
—Israeli leader, Moshe Dayan, quoted in Benjamin Beit-Hallahmi's "Original Sins."


2. Much of the land was legally purchased by Jews before the establishment of the state of Israel.

”[The Ottoman Land Code of 1858] required the registration in the name of individual owners of agricultural land, most of which had never previously been registered and which had formerly been treated according to traditional forms of land tenure…The new law meant that for the first time a peasant could be deprived not of title to his land, which he had rarely held before, but rather of the right to live on it, cultivate it and pass it on to his heirs, which had formerly been inalienable…Under the provisions of the 1858 law, communal rights of tenure were often ignored…Instead, members of the upper classes, adept at manipulating or circumventing the legal process, registered large areas of land as theirs…The fellahin [peasants] naturally considered the land to be theirs, and often discovered that they had ceased to be the legal owners only when the land was sold to Jewish settlers by an absentee landlord…Not only was the land being purchased; its Arab cultivators were being dispossessed and replaced by foreigners who had overt political objectives in Palestine.”
—Rashid Khalidi, “Blaming The Victims,” ed. Said and Hitchens

”In 1948, at the moment that Israel declared itself a state, it legally owned a little, no more than 6 percent of the land of Palestine.”
—Edward Said, “The Question of Palestine.”

3. “Palestine was a barren desert before Israel reclaimed and cultivated it.”

[In Ottoman-controlled Palestine] “Farming in the plains and valleys produced a variety of products hungrily consumed in Europe—wheat, barley, and maize, for example—but the choice export item in Palestine was the juicy, thick-skinned, and easy to transport Jaffa orange. Citrus fruits were in high demand in European markets at the turn of the century, and the high profits justified the investment in irrigation…The introduction of the internal combustion engine in 1897 allowed orchard owners to improve vastly their access to underground aquifers. Citrus acreage expanded significantly.” — Martin Bunton, The Palestinian-Israeli Conflict: A Very Short Introduction (New York: Oxford University Press, 2013), 6, 9

“The Holy Land, since the Crusader genocide, has been renowned for its olive groves and olive oil industry; and long before Zionist immigration began in 1920, Palestine was known as a citrus exporting country, famous for the Jaffa Orange. It is unknown when the citrus industry was first developed in Palestine but records shows that in 1912-13, the Arabs had exported 1,608,570 cases of oranges to Europe.

As regards the hill regions, the country is covered with olive orchards, vineyards and other deciduous fruit trees; while the lands in the South were used for the cultivation of grain, and those in the Jordan Valley for the production of vegetables and fruits. Every inch of fertile soil was used to full capacity; and more and more rocky patches were being turned into orchards and groves.” —Refaat M. Loubani, “Palestine Before 1947” posted 11/7/01 (accessed 12/1/15)

"We abroad are used to believe the Eretz Yisrael is now almost totally desolate, a desert that is not sowed…But in truth that is not the case. Throughout the country it is difficult to find fields that are not sowed. Only sand dunes and stony mountains…are not cultivated."
(Ahad Ha'Am, a leading Eastern European Jewish essayist who visited Palestine in 1891 for three months , in Righteous Victims, p. 42)

“Britain’s high commissioner for Palestine, John Chancellor, recommended total suspension of Jewish immigration and land purchase to protect Arab agriculture. He said ‘all cultivable land was occupied; that no cultivable land now in possession of the indigenous population could be sold to Jews without creating a class of landless Arab cultivators’…The Colonial Office rejected the recommendation.” John Quigley, “Palestine and Israel: A Challenge to Justice.”

4. “Israel just wants to be left alone; it is the Palestinians who are the aggressors.”

"The Arab League hastily called for its member countries to send regular army troops into Palestine. They were ordered to secure only the sections of Palestine given to the Arabs under the partition plan. But these regular armies were ill equipped and lacked any central command to coordinate their efforts...[Jordan's King Abdullah] promised [the Israelis and the British] that his troops, the Arab Legion, the only real fighting force among the Arab armies, would avoid fighting with Jewish settlements...Yet Western historians record this as the moment when the young state of Israel fought off "the overwhelming hordes' of five Arab countries. In reality, the Israeli offensive against the Palestinians intensified."
—"Our Roots Are Still Alive," by the Peoples Press Palestine Book Project.

“Before the end of the mandate and, therefore before any possible intervention by Arab states, the Jews, taking advantage of their superior military preparation and organization, had occupied…most of the Arab cities in Palestine before May 15,1948. Tiberias was occupied on April 19,1948, Haifa on April 22, Jaffa on April 28, the Arab quarters in the New City of Jerusalem on April 30, Beisan on May 8, Safad on May 10 and Acre on May 14,1948…In contrast, the Palestine Arabs did not seize any of the territories reserved for the Jewish state under the partition resolution.”
—British author, Henry Cattan, “Palestine, The Arabs and Israel.”

“That Ben-Gurion’s ultimate aim was to evacuate as much of the Arab population as possible from the Jewish state can hardly be doubted, if only from the variety of means he employed to achieve his purpose…most decisively, the destruction of whole villages and the eviction of their inhabitants…even [if] they had not participated in the war and had stayed in Israel hoping to live in peace and equality, as promised in the Declaration of Independence.”
—Israeli author, Simha Flapan, “The Birth of Israel.”

“Menahem Begin, the Leader of the Irgun, tells how ‘in Jerusalem, as elsewhere, we were the first to pass from the defensive to the offensive…Arabs began to flee in terror…Hagana was carrying out successful attacks on other fronts, while all the Jewish forces proceeded to advance through Haifa like a knife through butter’..The Israelis now allege that the Palestine war began with the entry of the Arab armies into Palestine after 15 May 1948. But that was the second phase of the war; they overlook the massacres, expulsions and dispossessions which took place prior to that date and which necessitated Arab states’ intervention.”
—Sami Hadawi, “Bitter Harvest.”

“In June 1967, we again had a choice. The Egyptian Army concentrations in the Sinai approaches do not prove that Nasser was really about to attack us. We must be honest with ourselves. We decided to attack him."
— Menahem Begin, cited by Noam Chomsky, "The Fateful Triangle."

"I do not think Nasser wanted war. The two divisions he sent to The Sinai would not have been sufficient to launch an offensive war. He knew it and we knew it."
—Yitzhak Rabin, Israel's Chief of Staff in 1967, in Le Monde, 2/28/68

"Moshe Dayan, the celebrated commander who, as Defense Minister in 1967, gave the order to conquer the Golan...[said] many of the firefights with the Syrians were deliberately provoked by Israel, and the kibbutz residents who pressed the Government to take the Golan Heights did so less for security than for the farmland...’We would send a tractor to plow some area where it wasn't possible to do anything, in the demilitarized area, and knew in advance that the Syrians would start to shoot. If they didn't shoot, we would tell the tractor to advance further, until in the end the Syrians would get annoyed and shoot.

And then we would use artillery and later the air force also, and that's how it was...The Syrians, on the fourth day of the war, were not a threat to us.'"
—The New York Times, May 11, 1997

"The main danger which Israel, as a 'Jewish state', poses to its own people, to other Jews and to its neighbors, is its ideologically motivated pursuit of territorial expansion and the inevitable series of wars resulting from this aim..."
—Israeli professor, Israel Shahak, "Jewish History, Jewish Religion: The Weight of 3000 Years."

In Israeli Prime Minister Moshe Sharatt's personal diaries, there is an excerpt from May of 1955 in which he quotes Moshe Dayan as follows: "[Israel] must see the sword as the main, if not the only, instrument with which to keep its morale high and to retain its moral tension. Toward this end it may, no—it must—invent dangers, and to do this it must adopt the method of provocation and- revenge...And above all—let us hope for a new war with the Arab countries, so that we may finally get rid of our troubles and acquire our space."
—Quoted in Livia Rokach, "Israel's Sacred Terrorism."

5. “Israel’s survival and military conquests against hostile Arabs is nothing short of miraculous.”

“[In 1948] these regular [Arab] armies were ill equipped and lacked any central command to coordinate their efforts...[Jordan's] troops…[were] the only real fighting force among the Arab armies.”
—"Our Roots Are Still Alive"


6. Modern Israel is a modern democratic nation amid Arab totalitarian monarchies

“Even if nobody lost their land, the [Zionist] program was unjust in principle because it denied majority political rights… Zionism, in principle, could not allow the natives to exercise their political rights because it would mean the end of the Zionist enterprise.”
—Benjamin Beit-Hallahmi, “Original Sins.”

"The abstention from formulating a constitution was no accident. The massive expropriation of lands and other properties from those Arabs who fled the country as a result of the War of Independence and of those who remained but were declared absent, as well as the confiscation of large tracts of land from Arab villages who did not flee, and the laws passed to legalize those acts—all this would have necessarily been declared unconstitutional, null and void, by the Supreme Court, being expressly discriminatory against one part of the citizenry, whereas a democratic constitution obliges the state to treat all of its citizens equally."
—Israeli author, Boas Evron, "Jewish State or Israeli Nation?"

“’The 1989 Israel High Court decision that any political party advocating full equality between Arab and Jew can be barred from fielding candidates in an election…[means] that the Israeli state is the state of the Jews…not their [the Arabs’] state.”
—Professor Norman Finkelstein, “Image and Reality of the IsraelPalestine Conflict.”

“Israel has crossed the threshold from ‘the only democracy in the Middle East’ to the only apartheid regime in the Western world.”
—Henry Siegman, Rabbi and director of the U.S./Middle East Project

What happened?

A. Ottoman Turks control Palestine (1517-1917)

1. Arabs came to Palestine in the seventh century, and intermarried with the native population, who adopted Arabic language and Islamic religion. They have been there for 1,300 years.

2. Ottoman Turks conquered the region in 1516.

3. There were about 30 Jewish communities throughout Palestine, with their center in Safed.

4. In 1880, the population was 95% Arab (456,000), and 5% Jewish (24,000)

5. Jewish settlers began to immigrate in 1881; by 1914, Jews in Palestine numbered 60,000

B. British troops, under General Edmund Allenby, (with help of French & Arabs) drive out Turks (1917).

1. The Balfour Declaration (England, November 2, 1917):

“His Majesty’s Government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country.”
— Arthur James Balfour (British Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, and a Dispensationalist)

C. League of Nations Mandate for Palestine (1922) placed Palestine under Britain’s oversight, and Syria under France.

“The mandate system was especially problematic in Palestine, the mandate for which incorporated the entire text of the Balfour Declaration, thus placing the small Jewish minority, composing about 10 per cent of the population, in a uniquely privileged position. The mandate also included several articles specifying the obligation of Britain, as mandatory power, to support the establishment of a Jewish national home in Palestine (for example, facilitating Jewish immigration and encouraging Jewish settlement on the land).“
— Martin Bunton, The Palestinian-Israeli Conflict: A Very Short Introduction (New York: Oxford University Press, 2013), 22

D. British announce intention to give up mandate responsibility. The United Nations Partition Plan recommends two states—one Israeli, one Palestinian—and recommends boundaries for each (1947)

1. Jewish state would have 52% of the land, 497,000 Arabs and 498,000 Jews

2. Arab state would have 48% of the land, 725,000 Arabs and 10,000 Jews

3. The plan was approved by a 2 to 3 majority of the UN General Assembly, due to influence of the USA

4. April 9, 1948, Irgun, a Jewish paramilitary group, led by Menachem Begin, killed (by some reports) 254 Arab men, women and children at the village Deir Yassin,.

5. April 12, 1948, by way of reprisal, Arabs killed 77 Jewish doctors, nurses, teachers and university students in a convey traveling to the Hadassah Hospital.

E. Israel declares independence, war erupts, Jerusalem divided between Israel & Jordan (1948)

1. British Mandate ended May 14, 1948. The same day, Dr. Chaim Weizmann raised the flag of the star of David, and David Ben Gurion proclaimed the new State of Israel.

2. Arabs did not agree with the UN Partition Plan, and sought to destroy the Jewish State. Within hours of the proclamation, forces from Jordan, Syria, Egypt, Lebanon and Iraq attacked. Arab troops were disorganized and no match for Israel’s modern fighting force.

3. Fighting continued seven months. By the time of the ceasefire, in January, 1949, Israel controlled 77% of the land, including Galilee and the Negev, which would have been part of the Arab state under the Partition.

4. Jerusalem was divided, with Israel controlling the Western, and Jordan controlling the Eastern, sectors. Jordan also annexed the West Bank.

5. Palestinian Arabs’ society was largely destroyed. In the war, 750,000 Palestinians fled their homes and farms, crossing borders into Jordan Lebanon and Syria. About 200,000 were confined to the Gaza Strip (139 sq.mi.), which already had 88,000 residents.

6. These Palestinians were not permitted, by Israel, to return home after the ceasefire. They became homeless refugees.

7. Over the next 3 years, the new wave of immigrants doubled the Jewish population of Israel.

F. Ongoing Arab-Israeli Conflict

1. Displaced Palestinian refugees often tried to cross the ceasefire lines to be rejoined with family, to harvest their crops, or to sabotage Israeli immigrants’ attempts to develop their appropriated lands for their own purposes. Israel’s retaliation was often excessive.

2. In 1953, Israeli raids crossed the lines to kill 69 villagers in Qibya, a West Bank town. Israel also raided Gaza, in 1955, killing38 Egyptian soldiers there.

3. Suez Canal (1956). Israel, allied with Britain and France, invaded the Sinai Peninsula, to challenge Egypt’s king Gamal abd al-Nasser over control of the Suez Canal. The action was condemned by the United States, and Israel was forced to withdraw from the Sinai Peninsula.

4. Six-Day War (1967). A border skirmish in April, 1967, resulted in an air war between Israeli and Syrian fighter jets over Damascus. Israel easily defeated the Syrian air force. In May, Egypt’s Nasser moved a fighting force into the Sinai as a show of strength against Israel, and shut down the Strait of Tiran to Israeli ships. Israel considered this an act of war, and launched a preemptive strike on Egypt’s forces, on June 5th—destroying 85% of Egypt’s air force on the ground in a matter of hours. Thereby, Israel took from Egypt the Sinai and Gaza. In subsequent fighting, Israel took the Golan Heights and the West Bank from Egypt’s allies, Syria and Jordan, respectively. The capture of West Bank territories included East Jerusalem, which came under Israel’s control for the first time since 1929.

“By any measurement, the Israeli victory was overwhelming. The Egyptians had lost up to 15,000 soldiers, and another 5,000 had been wounded. Jordan’s figures were 700 killed and 6,000 wounded or missing. Syria’s dead numbered 450, with about 1,800 wounded. Israel counted 800 dead and about three times as many wounded. While Arabs held 15 Israeli POWs, Israel held 5,000 Egyptians, 550 Jordanians, and 365 Syrians. The Arab states also lost significant amounts of their military hardware, especially their combat aircraft. Egypt, for example, lost 85 Percent of its warplanes on the first day, including all of its bombers.

As many as 250,000 Palestinians on the West Bank fled their homes for Jordan when the fighting started, many of them becoming refugees for the second time. The Syrian civilian population also evacuated the Golan Heights. As a result of the war, Israel now occupied the Sinai, the Gaza Strip, the West Bank, and the Golan Heights, which made the country three and a half times its original size.”
—Timothy P. Weber, “On the road to Armageddon : how evangelicals became Israel’s best friend” (Grand Rapids: Baker Academic, 2004), 183

November, 1967, the U.N. Security Counsel passed Resolution 242, requiring Israel to withdraw the recently occupied territories, and requiring the Arab states to recognize Israel’s right to exist. Jordan agreed to the Resolution, as did Egypt (officially). Other Arab nations refused. Israel agreed to withdraw on the condition of there being a lasting peace. This did not occur.

In 1982, as a result of the 1979 Israel-Egypt Peace Treaty (following the Yom Kippur War of 1973), Israel withdrew from most of the Sinai Peninsula.

In 2015, Israel voluntarily “disengaged” from Gaza, withdrawing Israel’s military personnel and dismanteling Israeli settlements in the region.

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Re: What is happened to Israel is happening now to all the w

Post by Paidion » Fri Aug 12, 2016 5:19 pm

“That Ben-Gurion’s ultimate aim was to evacuate as much of the Arab population as possible from the Jewish state can hardly be doubted, if only from the variety of means he employed to achieve his purpose…most decisively, the destruction of whole villages and the eviction of their inhabitants…even [if] they had not participated in the war and had stayed in Israel hoping to live in peace and equality, as promised in the Declaration of Independence.”
—Israeli author, Simha Flapan, “The Birth of Israel.”

“Menahem Begin, the Leader of the Irgun, tells how ‘in Jerusalem, as elsewhere, we were the first to pass from the defensive to the offensive…Arabs began to flee in terror…Hagana was carrying out successful attacks on other fronts, while all the Jewish forces proceeded to advance through Haifa like a knife through butter’..The Israelis now allege that the Palestine war began with the entry of the Arab armies into Palestine after 15 May 1948. But that was the second phase of the war; they overlook the massacres, expulsions and dispossessions which took place prior to that date and which necessitated Arab states’ intervention.”
—Sami Hadawi, “Bitter Harvest.”
Sounds almost like a re-enactment of ancient Israel driving out the peoples from the land that God had supposedly promised them (though not quite as thorough in the matter of elimination of the inhabitants):

“When the LORD your God brings you into the land that you are entering to take possession of it, and clears away many nations before you, the Hittites, the Girgashites, the Amorites, the Canaanites, the Perizzites, the Hivites, and the Jebusites, seven nations more numerous and mightier than yourselves, and when the LORD your God gives them over to you, and you defeat them, then you must devote them to complete destruction. You shall make no covenant with them and show no mercy to them.
(Deuteronomy 7:1,2 ESV)
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Re: What is happened to Israel is happening now to all the w

Post by steve » Fri Aug 12, 2016 5:53 pm

Hi Paidion,

Yes, to someone of your view, who thinks God never gave such commands in the Old Testament (but that Moses mistakenly thought these were God's commands) the situation would be quite parallel.

To those who believe the Old Testament, and therefore accept the divine gift of Canaan to Israel as reality, there is no such parallel. There is no corresponding command from God telling modern Israel to exterminate or drive from their homes the natives of Palestine.

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Re: What is happened to Israel is happening now to all the w

Post by Paidion » Fri Aug 12, 2016 7:32 pm

Hi Steve, you wrote:To those who believe the Old Testament, and therefore accept the divine gift of Canaan to Israel as reality, there is no such parallel. There is no corresponding command from God telling modern Israel to exterminate or drive from their homes the natives of Palestine.
Actually there are many people who make the same claim today, that it was God who re-established Israel in accordance with Old Testament prophecy, and gave modern Israel the mandate to drive out the Palestinians and the ability to do so. So for these people, the parallel stands, for they believe that God was behind both.

http://chosenpeople.com/main/prophecy/2 ... f-prophecy

https://int.icej.org/media/christian-zionism-101

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jso ... onism.html
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Re: What is happened to Israel is happening now to all the w

Post by steve » Sat Aug 13, 2016 12:10 am

I would be surprised if you were thinking I did not know how many people see the modern state of Israel as fulfilled prophecy. It is the most frequently encountered viewpoint among dispensationalists.

They simply can't identify any particular prophecy that predicts there return of the Jews to the land in unbelief. Nor can they find a prophecy that speaks of the Jews returning from exile, which was itself uttered after that return had occurred in the sixth century B.C.

Even if God wanted Israel to return, He would not wish for them to be violating His commands in Torah that tell them not to oppress the stranger in their borders—or the command, "You shall not covet your neighbor's house."

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Re: What is happened to Israel is happening now to all the w

Post by Paidion » Sat Aug 13, 2016 9:08 am

I was well aware that you are familiar with the dispensationalist view.

This discussion began with my comment "Sounds almost like a re-enactment of ancient Israel driving out the peoples from the land that God had supposedly promised them" and you wrote:
To those who believe the Old Testament, and therefore accept the divine gift of Canaan to Israel as reality, there is no such parallel. There is no corresponding command from God telling modern Israel to exterminate or drive from their homes the natives of Palestine."
Then I was trying to show that there is a large group of people (many of whom are dispensationalists) who believe the Old Testament, and who also believe that it is God's doing that modern Jews reclaim the land God had promised them, and that this was his declared purpose in prophecy. So for those people there is a parallel, though unlike me (you hint that I don't), they "believe the Old Testament."

For those folks there is a parallel since God was behind both dispossessions. For me there is a parallel since He was behind neither. It seems that one has to be a Preterist, to conclude that "there is no such parallel" since Preterists claim that God is behind the extermination of the Canaanites (because the Bible tells them so) but not behind the repossession of the promised land (because the prophecies have all been fulfilled).
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Man judges a person by his past deeds, and administers penalties for his wrongdoing. God judges a person by his present character, and disciplines him that he may become righteous.

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