introducing Bible Protector

[bibleprotector]

Another KJV defect.

P.S. I love the KJV!

Double minded?

KJV-Onlyists place their faith in the notion that God decreed that the KJV translators would produce an error-free Bible. There is no compelling Scriptural support for that notion.

But God has supplied us His Word perfectly today, so where is it? Or, perhaps you don't really believe we have God's words without errors.

I can imagine your version right now:

How I love most of thy law, most of it is my meditation most the day. Thy word is 99% pure, but thy servant still loveth it, except thy servant also loveth saying there are defects in the Bible, and doesn't have one without defects.

[Candlepower]

Double minded?

Not at all. I love you, and you're not perfect.

[SteveF]

How I love most of thy law, most of it is my meditation most the day. Thy word is 99% pure, but thy servant still loveth it, except thy servant also loveth saying there are defects in the Bible, and doesn't have one without defects.

BP, I’m glad I met a few strong KJV only advocates, much like you, earlier in my Christian walk. They were the ones that propelled me to understand how the Bible I was holding in my hands actually came to be. Before I looked into it I didn’t have 99% assurance of what was written. It was more of an unstable assurance based on a vague belief.

I’m very happy there is soooo much evidence to support the transmission of the Scripture and I’m grateful for every Christian who made the effort to copy out the Scriptures.

And yes, I used the word “evidence”. For many Christians evidence is important as well as faith. I for one am glad there are witness accounts of the life and resurrection of Christ which are recorded and faithfully passed down. Perhaps you don’t need “evidence” like a witness account that we can clearly trace back to the apostles through manuscripts. It seems it’s your decision to just believe and disdain the need for evidence. That’s your choice but I’m certainly glad that God has ensured we have that evidence. It’s there for anyone who takes the time to look. It’s fascinating.

[bibleprotector]

For many Christians evidence is important as well as faith.

Your terminology does not make sense.

Heb 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

Are you saying that what you see with your natural eyes and hear from men is greater than the reasonable, supplied godly evidence from God?

Remember, a story (i.e. a theory or hypothesis) made up by people today about the transmission of Scripture (i.e. modern textual criticism) is not evidence. It is a present-time story.

[SteveF]

Your terminology does not make sense.

I meant exactly what I said!

Are you saying that what you see with your natural eyes and hear from men is greater than the reasonable, supplied godly evidence from God?

I am grateful for any way God so chooses to express and confirm His truth to me.

[bibleprotector]

I am grateful for any way God so chooses to express and confirm His truth to me.

Well, God wouldn't be sending you to anoint the next king of Israel then.

[jriccitelli]

Our Faith is not a blind faith, our faith is firmly founded on fact. The fact of Creation, that the God of the Hebrews is the Omnipotent Creator. God never shied away from providing proof, in fact God demands absolute fulfillment for trust in a Prophet. Many miracles and prophecies have laid the foundation of our faith. Jesus asks them to search the scriptures to see that indeed He does fulfill the demand of scriptural witness. I could go on... I was brought to faith in Christ because i was moved by the Logic and wisdom of Christ, and the archeological agreement of the Old Testament with ancient History (because i had studied ancient history previously).

Christ appeals to reason and logic - He is the LOGOS -Jesus never skirts around logic, He answered them and they couldn't answer His wisdom.

In my testimony i relate how when reading through John one day I was overcome with Jesus' answers to the religious leaders - His answers were fantastic - most notably His answer to the question of should we pay taxes to Caesar, it was these wise answers that made me believe He was the Christ (because i had studied a economics once).

God 'verified' His Word with many convincing proofs, we are told to not just accept someones reasoning without thinking, we are to test all things.
You are confusing higher criticism for textual criticism, we do not doubt the authorship or divine authority of all of Gods Word, higher criticism tries to undermine belief and divine inspiration. Textual criticism is what the KJV translators used to discern the best manuscripts, there is nothing within our research that would deny the divine inspiration, it is just truth that tells us there are different words in the texts to say the same thing, and the difficulty to find an exact word to translate another languages words (there is no doubt of the author or divine inspiration, it is just that we have to be wary of mans transmission of it, how can that not be wise??).

Again do you have an answer to my two questions? I understand you know where i'm going with it, if there is another second translation to choose, you would have to do so based on the 'best' manuscripts, how would you discern that? Or do you have some 'other way' of picking the 'second' most accurate transmissions? (the NKJV does not count)

[bibleprotector]

Christ appeals to reason and logic

This is true, but modern textual criticism is unreasonable because it really has no place for God. You don't need to believe in God to believe the same thing about modern versions that Christians do.

He is the LOGOS

I guess you are in a different religion to me, in that I believe Jesus is the Son of God, not some strange, umbiblical word.

[jriccitelli]

Um, Jesus is the Word, He is Creator, He is the Lamb, He is the Life, He is the Judge, Shepherd, Husband, King, Lord, Vine, Rock, and He is the Logos.

All your verses still only point out that God keeps his Word, we have His Word and we can trust the manuscripts are enough for us to know His Word.

How do you translate all the alphabetic sequencing found in some of the Psalms? How do you translate the Hebrew idioms, there is also word play and rhyme... you can only discern some of this by studying the language...

[bibleprotector]

and He is the Logos.

I am sorry, but I cannot find support for this in the Bible. Someone might think that you are saying he is a space monster or a kind of cheese.

All your verses still only point out that God keeps his Word, we have His Word and we can trust the manuscripts are enough for us to know His Word.

The problem is that you cannot point to His exact words.

How do you translate all the alphabetic sequencing found in some of the Psalms?

There is no thing of effect in the Word of God, that's like saying, "I would like to see God's word written with letters that are straight rather than curved". We have Psalm 119 with headings, which is obviously a kind of sub-sectioning.

How do you translate the Hebrew idioms

Hebrew has already been translated properly into English by the KJB men, so it does not require me to do anything ... and the full nuance and exact communication of the sense is occurring in the English. If you differ to that, it is because you are today (in the present time) adding new or unknown concepts into the past (i.e. an unhistorical argument, or anachronistic). Sort of like how an evolutionist makes up a story about two animals fighting by a swamp and then getting buried in the mud.

there is also word play

Yes, we observe it all the time with the perversion of God's name from JEHOVAH and the name of Jesus like a game of doublets.

and rhyme...

This is of no effect in the communication of the concepts of the Word of God. If you want poetry, you only need to read the Bible in English. It is a fiction which attributes somehow superior, mystical and literary qualities to Hebrew over and above the exact, accurate and full communication of truth in English. If English had not been providentially formed by God, it would not be possible to convey the very beauty and full life of the Scripture, but it is: whereas Hebrew is virtually a dead language, English is strong and well.

you can only discern some of this by studying the language...

Actually, we are told to study the Scripture, not study languages. There is no special command nor any blessing in Scripture attached to knowing Hebrew, nor is there any requirement to know it. In fact, the opposite is reality: "For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people." (Isaiah 28:11).