Does The Ark Represent Jesus? or Mary?

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Does The Ark Represent Jesus? or Mary?

Post by seer » Thu Dec 11, 2008 2:03 pm

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Hello Tom,

Glad you could join us. As far as pulling things out of a hat - I would say yes, the Catholic church does. For instance the idea that the Holy Spirit was Mary's husband. Or that the Ark was a picture/type of Mary. We discussed these in our e-mail exchange, perhaps we can pick them up here.
Thanks to the human heart by which we live, thanks to its tenderness, its joys, and fears, To me the meanest flower that blows can give thoughts that do often lie too deep for tears. Wordsworth

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Post by Jill » Thu Dec 11, 2008 9:49 pm

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Re: Was The Holy Spirit Mary's Husband?

Post by darinhouston » Fri Dec 12, 2008 12:07 am

karenprtlnd wrote:I heard your comment on the radio today. It was the first time that I had heard this kind of Idea before, about the Ark being The Mother Mary. Mister Greggs comment I felt was to be honored in this regard that the Ark, containing the Law, would be Christ and not the mother of his boyhood.
I haven't heard today's show yet, but I think that the most offensive things about many of the Catholic beliefs and Dispensationalism, etc. are when they ascribe things about Christ to others such as Satan or Mary or others and twist things about our Lord, Himself.

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Post by Jill » Fri Dec 12, 2008 8:00 pm

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Re: Was The Holy Spirit Mary's Husband?

Post by tom » Sat Dec 13, 2008 12:49 am

Okay,

If I can ask Jim since we have been talking about the Catholic Church for at least six months, if I can cut and paste what we have already written? I know for him it will be redundant but if others have their input and I change some of what I have written it may be beneficial and interesting.

As far as Steve Gregg saying he thinks "Jesus is the Ark and not Mary", I don't buy it. The reason? Jesus IS the last High Priest, (Aaron's rod, the first High Priest). Jesus IS the Bread of Life, (Manna in the desert). Jesus IS the new law, (10 commandments). Jesus is the fulfillment of the items in the Ark not THE Ark. He is the contents of what is in Mary the new Ark.

Tom

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Was The Holy Spirit Mary's Husband?

Post by seer » Sat Dec 13, 2008 5:34 am

Sure Tom, feel free to post what you want. We could start with the Ark thing.
Thanks to the human heart by which we live, thanks to its tenderness, its joys, and fears, To me the meanest flower that blows can give thoughts that do often lie too deep for tears. Wordsworth

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Re: Was The Holy Spirit Mary's Husband?

Post by darinhouston » Sat Dec 13, 2008 9:06 am

tom wrote:Okay,

If I can ask Jim since we have been talking about the Catholic Church for at least six months, if I can cut and paste what we have already written? I know for him it will be redundant but if others have their input and I change some of what I have written it may be beneficial and interesting.

As far as Steve Gregg saying he thinks "Jesus is the Ark and not Mary", I don't buy it. The reason? Jesus IS the last High Priest, (Aaron's rod, the first High Priest). Jesus IS the Bread of Life, (Manna in the desert). Jesus IS the new law, (10 commandments). Jesus is the fulfillment of the items in the Ark not THE Ark. He is the contents of what is in Mary the new Ark.

Tom
Why can't Christ be "both" the contents and the vessel ? Besides, all the things you mention weren't contained in the Ark. In the incarnation, Jesus was both the fulfillment of those things, and the manner in which we learned about them (the vessel bringing them to us). Do you not agree with that?

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Post by Jill » Sat Dec 13, 2008 3:42 pm

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Re: Does The Ark Represent Jesus? or Mary?

Post by tom » Tue Dec 16, 2008 12:37 am

Let's start with this; The Ark was Holy because of what was held inside of it. Jesus could be considered the Ark in some ways but Jesus IS the items IN the Ark! Let's go through what the Bible has to say about Mary as the Ark.

Just a note, If you're, (we're), looking for Mary spelled out as "The Ark of the Covenant", we are not going to find it! We have in the Bible an unfolding story about our relationship with God. I say unfolding because we have to peel back the layers like an onion to find more and more unseen gems.

What was the Ark of the Covenant? It was the most holy object in Israel, (Num 4:4). The Ark went into battle for Israel and brought them into the promised land, (Joshua 3). It was so holy and powerful with the presence of God that even false gods bowed down to it, (1Sam 5:1-5).

Now let's compare the Ark and Mary. What did the Ark contain? It had God's Word, the 10 commandments, Aaron's rod that budded, (the first High Priest) and Manna from the desert. What did Mary carry in her womb? The Word of God, Jesus. The last High Priest, Jesus. The Bread come down from Heaven, Jesus!

Mary is "overshadowed" by the Holy Spirit, Luke 1:35. The Ark is "overshadowed" when it is consecrated in the Tabernacle, Ex 40:34.

Look at David bringing the Ark back to Jerusalem and Mary going to see Elizabeth.

Compare 2 Sam 6 with Luke 1.

2Sam 6:2 Luke 1:39
David arose and went back to Judah Mary arose and went into the hill country
to a city of Judah

2Sam 6:9 Luke 1:43
How can the Ark of the Lord come to me? ...and why is this granted me, that the
mother of my Lord should come to me?

2Sam 6:14 Luke 1:44
David came dancing before the Lord John the Baptist "leaped fro joy" at the
with abandon. sound of Mary's voice.

2Sam 6:12 Luke 1:47
David rejoices Mary's spirit rejoices

2Sam 6:11 Luke 1:56
The Ark of the Lord remained in the Mary remained with Elizabeth about
house of Obededom...for three months three months.



In Revelation 11:19-12:1 we read, "Then the temple of God was opened in heaven, and the ark of His covenant was seen in His temple. And there were lightnings, noises, thunderings, an earthquake, and great hail. Now a great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and on her head a garland of twelve stars." We see the Ark which was not seen for some 400 years and then the image of Mary, the mother of the male child.


Tom

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Re: Does The Ark Represent Jesus? or Mary?

Post by RND » Tue Dec 16, 2008 1:05 am

The scriptures either directly, metaphorically or prophetically speak of Jesus Christ and no other.

John 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

Luke 24:44 And he said unto them, These [are] the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and [in] the prophets, and [in] the psalms, concerning me.

The Ark, the contents of the Ark and the Mercy Seat covering the law all represent Jesus Christ.
"All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed, and third, it is accepted as self-evident." Arthur Schopenhauer, Philosopher, 1788-1860

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