What law is Paul speaking of re. words inexpressible and unlawful to speak?
Also, what should a person do regarding dreams they have that they believe are given of God?
Thank You, and God Bless,
Bud
2 Cor. 12:4
2 Cor. 12:4
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:
Reason:
Hi Bud.
In this passage, Paul is making an allusion to how Elijah the prophet was caught up to heaven. (He makes other allusions in his letters about, for example, going to Arabia to be personally instructed by God - and also says that Mount Sinai is in Arabia. Elijah also went to Mount Sinai when he had questions about what God was working out that he himself couldn't find answers to.)
Paul apparently knew someone - some people speculate that this might have been Christ, whereas others say it was Paul himself, but the answer technically doesn't matter - who had been caught up to heaven in the same manner as was Elijah the prophet of old. While there, certain things were revealed to this person which "it's not lawful to speak of [to others]."
To suggest a possible reason why, consider this. Jesus told His disciples not to tell anyone that He was the Messiah, once they had understood that to be the case (Mat. 16:13-20). Why not? Because telling people that Jesus was the Messiah wouldn't do them any good unless they could come to that understanding themselves! In other words, the knowledge was useless without the conviction to act on it.
I suggest that the same might be the case with whatever was revealed to this person who was caught up to heaven and to God's throne. Sharing that knowledge with others wouldn't benefit them if they themselves weren't ready to receive it.
As far as sharing dreams that may be of God, wisdom and discernment is called for. Praying for that discernment certainly can't hurt. I'd first ask yourself whether sharing this dream would benefit the people you might share it with, or whether in doing so, you might be giving someone knowledge that they're not yet ready to receive.
Damon
PS. The only other consideration that I can think of off hand is, where will the glory go if you share this dream? If the glory will go to you instead of to God, then it would be best not to share it.
In this passage, Paul is making an allusion to how Elijah the prophet was caught up to heaven. (He makes other allusions in his letters about, for example, going to Arabia to be personally instructed by God - and also says that Mount Sinai is in Arabia. Elijah also went to Mount Sinai when he had questions about what God was working out that he himself couldn't find answers to.)
Paul apparently knew someone - some people speculate that this might have been Christ, whereas others say it was Paul himself, but the answer technically doesn't matter - who had been caught up to heaven in the same manner as was Elijah the prophet of old. While there, certain things were revealed to this person which "it's not lawful to speak of [to others]."
To suggest a possible reason why, consider this. Jesus told His disciples not to tell anyone that He was the Messiah, once they had understood that to be the case (Mat. 16:13-20). Why not? Because telling people that Jesus was the Messiah wouldn't do them any good unless they could come to that understanding themselves! In other words, the knowledge was useless without the conviction to act on it.
I suggest that the same might be the case with whatever was revealed to this person who was caught up to heaven and to God's throne. Sharing that knowledge with others wouldn't benefit them if they themselves weren't ready to receive it.
As far as sharing dreams that may be of God, wisdom and discernment is called for. Praying for that discernment certainly can't hurt. I'd first ask yourself whether sharing this dream would benefit the people you might share it with, or whether in doing so, you might be giving someone knowledge that they're not yet ready to receive.
Damon
PS. The only other consideration that I can think of off hand is, where will the glory go if you share this dream? If the glory will go to you instead of to God, then it would be best not to share it.
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:
Reason:
I don't find it easy to see an allusion to Elijah's translation to heaven in Paul's words, since he twice states that he did not know whether, in the case of which he is speaking, there was an actual physical transportation to heaven, or an out-of-body experience (vv.2, 3). Elijah's experience was unmistakably a bodily transportation.
I am of the opinion that the man to whom Paul refers is Paul himself. I realize that this is not obvious, and is even awkward, given the wording he choses: "I knew a man..." But, given the context of the previous chapter, and the manner in which he opens the present chapter, I think the flow of thought strongly suggests that he is now adding to the previous list of his apostolic credentials the matter of revelations and visions (which, if they were not his own would be of no value in making his point).
To avoid sounding boastful in relating these revelations, he adopts a more "modest" literary device of speaking about "this guy I know..." I have observed modern authors do the same thing when relating an anecdote in which the author said something insightful and quotable in some previous conversation (now retold to make a point), but (apparently in the interest of humility) attributed the witticism, in the retelling, to "a certain man (or woman)."
Paul (or other privileged servants of God) might very well have vouchsafed to them privileged information in the presence of God, which was not to be widely diseminated. "The secret of the Lord is with them that fear Him" (Ps.25:14). Like anyone else, God has trusted "friends" with whom He will confide His every secret (Amos 3:7/ John 15:15). It is clear that God does not give these friends permission to declare these secrets in a public forum, consisting of individuals whom God Himself did not trust with the information.
John, similarly, was not permitted to write everything that was revealed to him on Patmos (Rev.10:4).
I believe that, when Paul was caught up to heaven, many things were revealed to him, some of which were his to teach the church (e.g., Eph.3:3-5), and others of which were "not lawful" (that is, not permissible) for him to repeat. They were for his ears and eyes only.
It is the fact that he was given private information, beyond that which he was permitted to teach the church, that makes the point so strongly that Paul was trying to make in 2 Corinthians 12:1ff, namely, that Paul is not some ordinary Christian teacher, but possesses a special status and authority reflected in the special relationship and intimacy into which God had brought him. Thus Paul's authority as an apostle stood on more impressive grounds than did that of the "super apostles" (the term Paul used, apparently, for the pretenders who claimed to possess greater apostolic authority than Paul possessed--2 Cor.11:5 and 12:11, in the Greek text).
Paul's reticence to share with the church all that had been revealed to him reflected the similar practice of Christ with His disciples (John 16:12). He left it up to the Holy Spirit to reveal some things directly to other individuals, rather than through a teacher.
This reticence might also provide a guide to the question of sharing dreams or revelations that you feel God has given you. It does not seem that it would be necessary for you to share them with others unless you are appealing to their discernment for confirmation, or you believe that they could prove relevant or edifying to those with whom you share them (1 Cor.14:26).
I am of the opinion that the man to whom Paul refers is Paul himself. I realize that this is not obvious, and is even awkward, given the wording he choses: "I knew a man..." But, given the context of the previous chapter, and the manner in which he opens the present chapter, I think the flow of thought strongly suggests that he is now adding to the previous list of his apostolic credentials the matter of revelations and visions (which, if they were not his own would be of no value in making his point).
To avoid sounding boastful in relating these revelations, he adopts a more "modest" literary device of speaking about "this guy I know..." I have observed modern authors do the same thing when relating an anecdote in which the author said something insightful and quotable in some previous conversation (now retold to make a point), but (apparently in the interest of humility) attributed the witticism, in the retelling, to "a certain man (or woman)."
Paul (or other privileged servants of God) might very well have vouchsafed to them privileged information in the presence of God, which was not to be widely diseminated. "The secret of the Lord is with them that fear Him" (Ps.25:14). Like anyone else, God has trusted "friends" with whom He will confide His every secret (Amos 3:7/ John 15:15). It is clear that God does not give these friends permission to declare these secrets in a public forum, consisting of individuals whom God Himself did not trust with the information.
John, similarly, was not permitted to write everything that was revealed to him on Patmos (Rev.10:4).
I believe that, when Paul was caught up to heaven, many things were revealed to him, some of which were his to teach the church (e.g., Eph.3:3-5), and others of which were "not lawful" (that is, not permissible) for him to repeat. They were for his ears and eyes only.
It is the fact that he was given private information, beyond that which he was permitted to teach the church, that makes the point so strongly that Paul was trying to make in 2 Corinthians 12:1ff, namely, that Paul is not some ordinary Christian teacher, but possesses a special status and authority reflected in the special relationship and intimacy into which God had brought him. Thus Paul's authority as an apostle stood on more impressive grounds than did that of the "super apostles" (the term Paul used, apparently, for the pretenders who claimed to possess greater apostolic authority than Paul possessed--2 Cor.11:5 and 12:11, in the Greek text).
Paul's reticence to share with the church all that had been revealed to him reflected the similar practice of Christ with His disciples (John 16:12). He left it up to the Holy Spirit to reveal some things directly to other individuals, rather than through a teacher.
This reticence might also provide a guide to the question of sharing dreams or revelations that you feel God has given you. It does not seem that it would be necessary for you to share them with others unless you are appealing to their discernment for confirmation, or you believe that they could prove relevant or edifying to those with whom you share them (1 Cor.14:26).
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:
Reason:
In Jesus,
Steve
Steve