Paul and Jesus

God, Christ, & The Holy Spirit
Post Reply
steve7150
Posts: 2550
Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2008 7:44 am

Paul and Jesus

Post by steve7150 » Sun Apr 26, 2020 11:58 am

I believe Paul and Luke who wrote a lot about him but there are some apparent differences between his teachings and certain of Jesus teachings. One of the apparent differences is about Pastors and teachers.
In John 10.16 Jesus is called the "sole pastor" and Matt 23.8-10 "sole teacher." The greek word for Pastor was "poimen" & is also used for Shepherd. In Eph 4.11 Paul uses the phrase "some pastors" as a title for certain people in a church. Paul gave the reasons for the various gifts he said God gave these various people in Eph 4 , but it seems to contradict Jesus teachings in the gospels about everything going through Him singularly.
There are other issues like this such as Pastor compensation,church structure, salvation,repentance but i won't get into that now.
I suspect that the answer may have to do with the fact that Paul was commissioned to bring the gospel to the gentiles & Jesus was gone so there had to be a delegation of responsibilities of some kind since the gentiles had no knowledge of God/Jesus or even the OT. So you need a shepherd, a teacher, a leader as long as they don't Lord over the brethren. What do you think?

User avatar
Homer
Posts: 2682
Joined: Sat Aug 23, 2008 11:08 pm

Re: Paul and Jesus

Post by Homer » Sun Apr 26, 2020 2:58 pm

Hi steve7150,

I think it is certain that Jesus appointed and commissioned the Apostles to be His spokesmen and reveal further truth to disciples, truth revealed to them through the Holy Spirit:

John 16:12-15
12. “I have many more things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. 13. But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come. 14. He will glorify Me, for He will take of Mine and will disclose it to you. 15. All things that the Father has are Mine; therefore I said that He takes of Mine and will disclose it to you.


There were many things the Apostles themselves weren't ready to hear until after Pentecost and the coming of the Holy Spirit, notably the inclusion of gentiles into the Kingdom on an equal basis.

User avatar
steve
Posts: 3362
Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2008 9:45 pm

Re: Paul and Jesus

Post by steve » Mon Apr 27, 2020 3:28 pm

The idea that there are gifts of the Spirit in no way contradicts anything Jesus taught. The idea that we are members of Christ's body, and variously gifted to carry out different functions, no doubt, has its precursor in the image of the Vine and the branches, in John 15:1-6. Paul diversifies the concept of the "branches" by substituting them with human body parts, to indicate the great diversity of functions.

Peter believed that elders were to "shepherd" the flock, without denying that Jesus was the Chief Shepherd (1 Peter 5:1-2, 4). Thus he included Jesus' teaching about Himself being the Good Shepherd as well as Paul's idea of elders "shepherding" the flock (Acts 20:28).

People who think they find problematic differences between Jesus and Paul need to learn to think more clearly about things they read. Here is a link to my chart demonstrating that Paul and Jesus taught everything of significance the same. http://www.matthew713.com/notes/files/J ... HHhqlIEVWs

steve7150
Posts: 2550
Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2008 7:44 am

Re: Paul and Jesus

Post by steve7150 » Tue Apr 28, 2020 8:33 am

People who think they find problematic differences between Jesus and Paul need to learn to think more clearly about things they read. Here is a link to my chart demonstrating that Paul and Jesus taught everything of significance the same. http://www.matthew713.com/notes/files/J ... HHhqlIEVWs




Thanks for the info!

Post Reply

Return to “Theology Proper, Christology, Pneumatology”