Dispensationalism and Historical Premillenialism

[schoel]

What are the differences between dispensationalism and historical premillenialism?

[RND]

Dispensationalism is a belief that God works with man in different ways during different time periods, i.e. God works with the modern, secular nation state of Israel different than He works with other modern, secular nation states. Historical Premillennialism believes the "antichrist" will appear after a seven year tribulation, and the resurrection comes at the appearing of Christ after a thousand-year reign of the saints, i.e. believers.

[steve]

RND wrote:

Historical Premillennialism believes the "antichrist" will appear after a seven year tribulation, and the resurrection comes at the appearing of Christ after a thousand-year reign of the saints, i.e. believers.

This may indeed describe the SDA view, but it does not correctly describe historic premillennialism.

Actually, both dispensationalism and historic premillennialism believe in the tribulation and the Antichrist, but neither place the rise of the Antichrist after the seven years. His rise is invariably placed either at the beginning or in the middle of the seven years. Also, the appearing (second coming) of Christ is not viewed as occurring "after a thousand-year reign of the saints" (that would be postmillennialism).

"Dispensationalism" and "historic premillennialism" are two different varieties of the larger category called premillennialism, or chiliasm (the latter term was used in the earliest centuries to describe the view, but most modern people use the former term).

Both views anticipate a future tribulation period—dominated by an evil tyrant they call "Antichrist"—followed by the second coming of Christ and a thousand-year reign of Christ and the saints on earth. Both views expect two resurrections: the first, occurring at the return of Christ (at the beginning of the millennium), involves only the saints. The second resurrection, occurring at the final judgment (at the end of the millennium), involves everyone else.

These views both differ from amillennialism and postmillenialism in their ideas of what happens when Jesus returns. Amillennialism and postmillennialism do not believe in two separate resurrections, but in one general resurrection of everybody at the coming of Christ. Also, they do not believe in a thousand-year reign after the coming of Christ, but believe that Jesus' second coming will usher-in the New Heavens and a New Earth—that is, the eternal state.

The main differences between dispensational and historical premillennialists would be that the former believe in a central role of the people and nation of Israel in the end times, and believe that the Church will be raptured into heaven before the tribulation time begins. Historic premillennialists do not accept these ideas, and believe that the church will not be raptured until the end of the tribulation. They believe that it will be the Church (not Israel) that is persecuted by Antichrist (after all, the term is "antichrist"—not "antiJew").

Additionally, though both of these groups believe in a future millennium after the return of Christ, they differ in their vision of the millennium. Dispensationalists believe that it will be a time in which the temple and Jewish forms of worship will be restored, and in which the Jewish people will be the prominent race. Historic premillennialists have never imposed these features upon the millennium.

"Historical" premillennialism is so called because many important church fathers, during the first three centuries, held to that view. That is, it is the "historical" view of much of the early church, as opposed to "dispensational" premillennialism, which had no ancient advocates, and was not introduced until 1830.

[Mellontes]

Well done Steve!

[Paidion]

In general Steve has correctly described the four views.

I would make only one addition. Some pre-millenialists believe that not all the saints will be raised at the first resurrection when Christ comes but only the overcomers .

Revelation 20:6 Blessed and holy is he who shares in the first resurrection! Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and they shall reign with him a thousand years.

These pre-millenialists also believe that the overcomers are granted other special privileges:

Revelation 2:7 "He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To him who overcomes I will give to eat from the tree of life, which is in the midst of the Paradise of God."’
Revelation 2:11 "He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. He who overcomes shall not be hurt by the second death."’
Revelation 2:17 "He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To him who overcomes I will give some of the hidden manna to eat. And I will give him a white stone, and on the stone a new name written which no one knows except him who receives it."’
Revelation 2:26 "And he who overcomes, and keeps My works until the end, to him I will give power over the nations––
Revelation 3:5 "He who overcomes shall be clothed in white garments, and I will not blot out his name from the Book of Life; but I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels.
Revelation 3:12 "He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he shall go out no more. And I will write on him the name of My God and the name of the city of My God, the New Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from My God. And I will write on him My new name.
Revelation 3:21 "To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.
Revelation 21:7 "He who overcomes shall inherit all things, and I will be his God and he shall be My son. NKJV

These pre-millenialists identify the overcomers with the manifested sons of God:

We know that the whole creation has been groaning in travail together until now; and not only the creation, but we ourselves, who have the first fruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait for our placing as sons, the redemption of our bodies. For in this hope we were saved. Romans 8:22-24a

According to these pre-millenialists, the overcomers are the mature sons of God who have walked the narrow way in discipleship.

It would seem to these pre-millenialists that saints who have not been overcomers, who have not become spiritually mature, will be raised in the second resurrection. For in the description of the judgment which John saw in his vision that occurs after the thousand years, these words are found:

...anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire. Rev 20:15

These words seem to suggest that the names of some of those who will be raised and judged in the second resurrection will be found written in the Book of Life.

[Mellontes]

Hey man! What do you mean by THE four different views. I see you have no room for us preterists... sniff...sniff...

[Paidion]

There's plenty of room for you preterists in the amillenial camp.

[steve]

Paidion is correct. Preterism is not a separate millennial position, but is usually a subcategory of belief held by many amillennialists and postmillennialists.

The distinctive strain of belief that Paidion describes is, of course, consistent with historical premillennialism. It is a minority view in this camp, however, and was not, to my knowledge, a part of the beliefs of the early fathers.

[RND]

RND wrote:

Historical Premillennialism believes the "antichrist" will appear after a seven year tribulation, and the resurrection comes at the appearing of Christ after a thousand-year reign of the saints, i.e. believers.

This may indeed describe the SDA view, but it does not correctly describe historic premillennialism.

Sure it does.....

"Historical Premillennialism believes the "antichrist" will appear after a seven year tribulation, and the resurrection comes at the appearing of Christ after (that) a thousand-year reign of the saints, i.e. believers."

I neglected the word (that)......

End times beliefs among Protestants:

Historical Premillennialism: This belief was held by a large percentage of Christians "during the first three centuries of the Christian era, and is found in the works of Papias, Irenaeus, Justin Martyr, Tertullian, Hippolytus, Methodius, Commodianus, and Lactanitus." 2 The Antichrist first appears on earth and the seven year Tribulation begins. Next comes the Rapture. Christ and his Church return to earth to rule for a Millennium. The faithful will spend eternity in the New Jerusalem. It is a gigantic cubical structure, some 1,380 miles height, width and depth, which will have descended to Earth. New Jerusalem is a.k.a. Celestial city, City of God, Heavenly Jerusalem, Holy city, Shining City on a Hill, Tabernacle of God, Zion, etc. The forces of evil will have been conquered. The faithful will live during this thousand years of peace in Jerusalem, while occupying spiritual bodies. After this period, all people are judged.

After Christianity became the official religion of Rome in the fourth century CE, this was declared a heresy and suppressed.

Eschatology Comparison

1. Distinctive Features and Emphases:

a. While often popularly confused with "dispensational premillennialism" with but a mere disagreement as to the timing of the "rapture," historic premillennialism is, in actuality, a completely different eschatological system, largely rejecting the whole dispensational understanding of redemptive history.

b. The basic features of historic premillennialism are as follows. When Jesus began his public ministry the kingdom of God was manifest through His ministry. Upon His ascension into heaven and the "Gift of the Spirit" at Pentecost, the kingdom is present through the Spirit, until the end of the age, which is marked by the return of Christ to the earth in judgement. During the period immediately preceding the return of Christ, there is great apostasy and tribulation.

C. After the return of Christ, there will be a period of 1000 years (the millennium separating the "first" resurrection from the "second" resurrection. Satan will be bound, and the kingdom will consummated, that is, made visible during this period.

d. At the end of the millennial period, Satan will be loosed and there will be a massive rebellion (of "Gog and Magog"), immediately preceding the "second" resurrection or final judgement. After this, there will be the creation of a new Heaven and Earth.

Seventh-day Adventist are not "Historical Premillennialists."

[steve]

RND,


I wrote, concerning your original post (above):

"This may indeed describe the SDA view, but it does not correctly describe historic premillennialism."

Then you responded: "Sure it does", and (strangely) posted the following:

End times beliefs among Protestants:

Historical Premillennialism: This belief was held by a large percentage of Christians "during the first three centuries of the Christian era, and is found in the works of Papias, Irenaeus, Justin Martyr, Tertullian, Hippolytus, Methodius, Commodianus, and Lactanitus." 2 The Antichrist first appears on earth and the seven year Tribulation begins. Next comes the Rapture. Christ and his Church return to earth to rule for a Millennium.

When you continue to claim that your original post characterizes "historical premillennialism"—and then post information that contradicts your original post—you give the appearance of carelessness of either thought, or reading, or both.

Your first post clearly said that historical premillennialism places the rise of Antichrist at the end of the tribulation, and the appearing of Christ at the end of the millennium. I corrected you, and the material you posted contradicts you. Yet you are not sufficiently perceptive (or, perhaps, sufficiently humble) to acknowledge that you made a mistake.

This has been your manner on many threads. It does not elevate our confidence in your honesty, your authority to answer questions accurately, nor your wisdom. Why not just admit that you made a mistake? Call it a typographical error, or an inaccurate wording too-hastily posted. But please do not try to tell us that what you said originally was correct. We can all read it for ourselves on this very page.