Daniel 9:24 - Completion of six events during the 70 weeks

End Times
Post Reply
thrombomodulin
Posts: 431
Joined: Sun Aug 24, 2008 6:59 am

Daniel 9:24 - Completion of six events during the 70 weeks

Post by thrombomodulin » Thu Oct 23, 2014 6:36 pm

Daniel 9:24 wrote: Seventy weeks have been decreed for your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to make an end of sin, to make atonement for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the most holy place.
Seventy weeks were allocated for the following six things:
  • 1. to finish the transgression
  • 2. to make an end of sin
  • 3. to make atonement for iniquity
  • 4. to bring in everlasting righteousness
  • 5. to seal up vision and prophecy
  • 6. to anoint the most holy place.
Considering the end of the 70th week was near 36 A.D., it seems not all of the above was completed.

Items #1 and #2 are a prima facie reason to suppose the prophecy was unfulfilled in 36 A.D. because Jewish people continued to sin after this. I suppose that one could argue that they were given only a finite time period to repent, like forty days that was allocated Nineveh, and when they failed to do so the Jews were rejected, and the Gentile were admitted into the kingdom of God.

Item #3 and #4 can easily be understood to be fulfilled in the death of Christ and bringing in of the new coventant.

Item #5 - I am not sure what the author means by "seal up", did he really mean "fulfill" instead?

Item #6 - What place was it that was anointed?

I would like to know how others understand the fulfillment of items #1, #2, #5, and #6.

Thanks
Pete

User avatar
dizerner
Posts: 1221
Joined: Fri Jun 27, 2014 4:43 pm

Re: Daniel 9:24 - Completion of six events during the 70 wee

Post by dizerner » Thu Oct 23, 2014 10:12 pm

I think you have the gist of it really. The way I would see "to finish the transgression" is, for example, like the scriptures "fill up then the measure of your fathers' guilt" or the "iniquity of the Amorites" not yet being "complete." It's almost as if sin has a course to run, from inception to culmination, ending in death and judgment. We see pictures of sin being "conceived" and "resulting in things you are now ashamed of" and then end is "death." The finishing of this transgression is I think the divorce of God with his people and his city, as exactly it was prophesied and fulfilled the moment Jesus said "but now you are left desolate."

I think these three:
2. to make an end of sin
3. to make atonement for iniquity
4. to bring in everlasting righteousness
They speak of the work of the cross. The power of sin is ended, the penalty of sin is paid, and the Holy Spirit is released.

5. to seal up vision and prophecy
This seems to be a tricky one. I think the author did mean seal up, in some way. Perhaps that now the Jewish people, since they rejected their Messiah, would experience a greater blindness to the Old Testament foreshadowing and spiritual light (judicial hardening)? Perhaps some kind of protective sealing, giving the prophecy a kind of dormancy until its fulfillment, or until the people come to whom it applies or who can use it? Some period of inactivity in that regard, seeing as enough had been said for now, seems to be the idea.

6. to anoint the most holy place.
What this reminds me of is Christ's own priestly ministry described in the book of Hebrews, in the sanctuary in heaven (which after all is the real most holy place). I suppose it could also mean God's anointing upon the hearts of his people, a type of Pentecost.
~ Classical Arminian Christian Mystic ~

User avatar
steve
Posts: 3362
Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2008 9:45 pm

Re: Daniel 9:24 - Completion of six events during the 70 wee

Post by steve » Thu Oct 23, 2014 10:38 pm

Amazingly, I did not see dizerner's post before posting mine. What is amazing is the close similarity in our responses:

1. to finish the transgression

Jesus said that the ancestors of His critics had made a career of killing God's messengers. He said that by killing Him they would "fill-up the measure" of their fathers' sins (Matt.23:32). This alludes to the biblical image of the cup of iniquity that a society fills by its continued wickedness, until they are forced to drink that cup in the form of wrath (Gen.15:16/ Psalm 75:8 / Jer.25:15ff / Rev.14:10). It is of the nature of cups that they have a maximum capacity, beyond which they can not be further filled. When a society's iniquity has filled their cup to capacity, it is time for God to empty it.

When Jesus made the above remark, it was as if to say, "You will finish up what your fathers have been working on for centuries—namely filling the cup of iniquity—which you will fill to the brim by killing me." This does not have to mean that there would be no more sinning on earth beyond this point. The prophecy of Daniel is discussing the end point of the period that is allotted to Daniel's people, the Jews. The curse of Deuteronomy 28 hung over their heads, awaiting only "the last straw"—the final transgression that pushes God over the edge and causes Him to release His wrath according to Deuteronomy and other passages. With reference to the transgressions relevant to that threat, they finished off the number necessary to fill the cup.

This career of transgression leading to judgment was completed, or finished, I believe, by the Jews of that generation, as Jesus said, "All these things will come upon this generation" (Matt.23:36).


2. to make an end of sin

I believe that this relates to the end of sin's dominion over man—not a reference to the commission of final sin of history. As we read in Hebrews 9:26— "but now, once at the end of the ages, He has appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself."

And Romans 8:3—
"For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh."



3. to make atonement for iniquity

4. to bring in everlasting righteousness


I agree with you that these two are easy, since the New Testament everywhere testifies that Jesus accomplished this in His death and resurrection.


5. to seal up vision and prophecy

I confess, I have always found this one difficult—not difficult to harmonize with any particular paradigm, but difficult to understand. Exactly what does it mean to "seal up vision and prophesy"? Daniel is later told to seal up his prophecy (Daniel 12:9), and John is told not to seal up his (Rev.22:10). But this imagery seems related to either the nearness of fulfillment or lack thereof, which does not seem to fit the imagery in Daniel 9. Perhaps the meaning is to "set the seal" of authenticity on prophecy (i.e., by fulfilling it?). I am not sure. Whatever it may mean, this ambiguity does not seem to serve a futurist paradigm any more than a preterist one. We would have to be sure of the meaning of the key phrase before we could explore into which fulfillment paradigm it best fits.

6. to anoint the most holy place.

This can be translated either "the most holy place," or "the most holy one." If the latter is chosen, and we see in it a reference to Christ ("the anointed One"), then we have little difficulty identifying this with the first coming of Christ.

On the other hand, if we take the translation you gave, we can, with scriptural warrant say that Jesus anointed (with His blood) the "most holy place" (that is, "the holy of holies") in heaven. This is what we are told in Hebrews 9:11-12—

"But Christ came as High Priest of the good things to come... Not with the blood of goats and calves, but with His own blood He entered the Most Holy Place once for all, having obtained eternal redemption."

dwilkins
Posts: 647
Joined: Fri Dec 21, 2012 2:54 pm

Re: Daniel 9:24 - Completion of six events during the 70 wee

Post by dwilkins » Sat Oct 25, 2014 10:27 am

There are a couple of things I'd add that I think clarify what's going on. First, the opening caveat “about your people and your holy city” provides a pretty narrow focus for the subsequent six point list. I don't think it's saying that all sin for all people for all time will end, but just that the sin related to the foundation for God's judgment against the nation will be accomplished. Likewise, since New Testament prophecy is essentially a series of interpretations of Old Testament prophecy (so, there is no really new prophecy in the New Testament) the sealing up of vision and prophecy only needs to say that what has been written about the destiny of the Jews will now happen as decreed. It should not be at all surprising, then, to find that the martrydom of Stephen happens according to many commentators at the precise point of the end of the 70 weeks in 34AD. One of the elements of that story that they key on is the fact that Christ is seen as standing next to the throne in heaven, which is supposed to indicate that a significant judgment has been made. If those observations are true, then it helps make sense of the order of events described in the rest of the passage. Everyone seems to agree for the most part on the interpretation of the first 69, but the last seven are a bit trickier:

Dan 9:26 And after the sixty-two weeks, an anointed one shall be cut off and shall have nothing. And the people of the prince who is to come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary. Its end shall come with a flood, and to the end there shall be war. Desolations are decreed.

One of the reasons that a gap theory is required in most interpretations is that they see the destruction, or “desolations” of the city as happening during the 70th week. But, all that's really required by the text is that this destruction happen after the 62nd (really 69th if we take them sequentially) week. In other words, it doesn't have to actually happen in the 70th Week, it just has to happen after the 69th Week. As you can see below, certain things seem to happen in the 70th Week that set matters in motion (or, once these things have happened the end is inevitable), but nowhere does it explicitly say that the desolations themselves will happen within the 70th Week.

Dan 9:27 And he shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and for half of the week he shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come one who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on the desolator."

Though I think there are some other interesting arguments for why the end of the 70th Week must be “the end” (which requires a gap of some kind for both Preston's and Stevens' version of Full Preterism as well as Dispensationslism), I think it's more likely that this is a continuous period. Below is my paraphrase of the passage:

There are seventy weeks (490 years) left for your people to determine their destiny. In that time the six important things are going to happen. Jerusalem will be rebuilt in a time of trouble and the Anointed, a prince, one will come 483 years after the rebuilding begins. After the 483 years the anointed one will be cut off. Also, the people of a coming prince will use war to destroy the city like a flood. One of these princes will make a strong covenant for with the people for one week. In the middle of it he will put and end to sacrifice and offerings. Abominations will be part of the prince who makes desolate and that prince will meet his end.

So, there are two princes in view: One good guy and one bad guy. Actions that happen at some point in the 70 weeks will result in a decreed end, or, at that point, the unavoidable national destiny. This is seen in the drama surrounding Stephen's martyrdom, where Christ is seen by Stephen (and the Sanhedrin?) standing next to the throne of God. No where does it say that the decreed end will happen within the 70 weeks. The six point list is associated with the 70 weeks, but not necessarily the war that becomes the city's destiny. Likewise, Jesus makes a strong promise towards the beginning of his ministry to the Apostles that he will lose none of them. He later says in the Upper Room Discourse that he has fulfilled his promise by not losing any of them up to that point, other than the one who was specifically caveated. In the middle of the 70th Week he is cut off. At the end of the 70the Week the church has its first martyr. The passage implies that the strong one week promise expires at the end of the week. During that last week the elements of the six point plan are fulfilled.

Edit:

I've been thinking quite a bit about the 70 Weeks since I wrote this (and possibly because I wrote this) and have changed my mind a bit about it. I'm going to leave this post here because I don't want to go around scrubbing evidence of changes that I make to my understanding. However, I don't think I was correct here.

Doug
Last edited by dwilkins on Sun Nov 23, 2014 8:52 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
robbyyoung
Posts: 811
Joined: Tue Sep 17, 2013 2:23 am

Re: Daniel 9:24 - Completion of six events during the 70 wee

Post by robbyyoung » Sat Oct 25, 2014 12:37 pm

Doug,

Daniel 9:24 is a precise "time indicator" is it not? For this reason, it cannot include Matt 24's second coming, the obvious reason is knowing "The Day". Therefore, I think our historical math may be wrong regarding how to compute the 490 years. To know for sure, I'm going to have to set aside some time to work backwards from what the NT Writers concluded in order to place these events. Also, it doesn't seem that Gabriel is placing these events in sequential order, it would have been most helpful if he did :) .

God Bless.

steve7150
Posts: 2553
Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2008 7:44 am

Re: Daniel 9:24 - Completion of six events during the 70 wee

Post by steve7150 » Sat Oct 25, 2014 2:33 pm


1. to finish the transgression
2. to make an end of sin
3. to make atonement for iniquity
4. to bring in everlasting righteousness
5. to seal up vision and prophecy
6. to anoint the most holy place.


Considering the end of the 70th week was near 36 A.D., it seems not all of the above was completed.

Items #1 and #2 are a prima facie reason to suppose the prophecy was unfulfilled in 36 A.D. because Jewish people continued to sin after this. I




Maybe it's not about people being righteous but about Jesus ministry of righteousness and sinlessness being a fulfillment or part of a fulfillment. Perhaps #5 refers to Jesus being the vision and #6 refers to the heavenly holy place Jesus anointed after he ascended.

thrombomodulin
Posts: 431
Joined: Sun Aug 24, 2008 6:59 am

Re: Daniel 9:24 - Completion of six events during the 70 wee

Post by thrombomodulin » Sun Oct 26, 2014 8:34 am

I would to thank all of you who have posted replies to my question. I am satisfied that none of the six items have to be understood as unfulfilled, thus necessitating a gap to delay the 70th week to a time future to ourselves.

As a matter of church history, when was a gap first proposed between the 69th and 70th weeks? Was Darby the first to do so?

Doug, Thanks for giving an explanation of the following verses also. In regard to those verses, I have found this post to have been very helpful.

Pete

thrombomodulin
Posts: 431
Joined: Sun Aug 24, 2008 6:59 am

Re: Daniel 9:24 - Completion of six events during the 70 weeks

Post by thrombomodulin » Sun May 31, 2020 8:11 am

Regarding item #5 in the list I would like to append this thread with a relevant quote from Athanasius, Incarnation, Ch. VI
But they shall be refuted on this supreme point more clearly than on any, and that not by ourselves but by the most wise Daniel, for he signifies ... that Jerusalem is to stand till His coming, and that after it prophet and vision shall cease in Israel! ... So the Jews are indulging in fiction, and transferring present time to future. When did prophet and vision cease from Israel? Was it not when Christ came, the Holy One of holies? It is, in fact, a sign and notable proof of the coming of the Word that Jerusalem no longer stands, neither is prophet raised up nor vision revealed among them.

Post Reply

Return to “Eschatology”