speaking in tongues

[glow]

I just came across this post on another chat board. Is this true!

there are actually 3 types of tongues

1 Other Earthly languages like in acts 2
2 Prayer language which would be a heavenly language 1st Corinthians 14:2-4
3 The gift of tongues which is when someone has a message for the church in tongues that need a interpretation (Not a translato, but someone with the spiritual gift of interpretation of tongues as this too is a heavenly language) 1st Corinthians 12:8-10, and 1st Corinthians 14:27-28

And the person said they were used all today when God wanted to use them.

[steve]

I believe this is correct.

[SamIam]

3 types of tongues? Are we to understand that

1. The languages in Acts 1 were normal human languages spoken in that part of the world (Greek, Latin, Aramaic, Syriac, Coptic, etc.)?
2. The languages in 1 Corinthians 14 were a heavenly prayer language? (How many of these are there?)
3. The languages in 1 Corinthians 12 were different languages from the heavenly prayer language(s)?

I suspect that this is modern pentecostal/charismatic practice being read back into the New Testament. The same words are used to describe the languages in Acts and 1 Corinthians. The existence of "heavenly prayer language" is an inference people drawn from the text rather than something explicitly stated in the text.

[TK]

Sam wrote:

I suspect that this is modern pentecostal/charismatic practice being read back into the New Testament. The same words are used to describe the languages in Acts and 1 Corinthians. The existence of "heavenly prayer language" is an inference people drawn from the text rather than something explicitly stated in the text.

Then Paul must have been a pentecostal/charismatic (i am certain he was!). He said he prayed in tongues. Why would he pray to God privately in an actual foreign language he didn't know? What purpose would there be in that?

TK

[SamIam]

Where does Paul say he prayed in tongues?

[Homer]

TK wrote:

Then Paul must have been a pentecostal/charismatic (i am certain he was!). He said he prayed in tongues. Why would he pray to God privately in an actual foreign language he didn't know? What purpose would there be in that?

And what purpose would there be in praying to God in a "heavenly language" Paul did not know? In either case he would not know what he was praying for and it would contradict Paul's stated intention to pray with his mind.

Actually, Paul is thought to have been multilingual and could have prayed in other languages with his mind fully engaged. When I was in high school I studied Spanish for three years and actually came to think in Spanish part of the time.

It seems rather odd to me that people think they have "speaking in tongues" all figured out when there is so little in scripture to build a doctrine on and then a subject like the final judgement can not be understood in spite of the plethora of warnings and stories about it. Could it be "the Holy Spirit will lead you into all truth" was a promise applicable only to those it was spoken to, or is this "leading into all truth" selective in regard to certain subjects?

Here is an informative, scholarly article by Glenn Peoples regarding tongues in the New Testament and the difference between languages and dialects:

http://www.preteristsite.com/plain/peoplestongues.html

[TK]

For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays, but my mind is unfruitful. So what shall I do? I will pray with my spirit, but I will also pray with my understanding; I will sing with my spirit, but I will also sing with my understanding. I Cor. 14:14-15

Paul seems to be saying he prays in tongues, and sings in tongues, but not all the time. There is a time and place for everything. That's how I read this, and it seems to make the most sense to me.

I will be the first to admit that the idea of praying in tongues is rather mysterious. Paul says, and I have heard various teachers say, that praying in a tongue edifies the person praying. I am not sure how it all works. But I know too many really solid Christians who pray in tongues and I cannot believe that they are simply "pretending" or "mistaken." And not everyone I know who prays in tongues is a pentecostal, or even a charismatic.

TK

[SamIam]

6 Now, brothers, if I come to you speaking in tongues, how will I benefit you unless I bring you some revelation or knowledge or prophecy or teaching? 7 If even lifeless instruments, such as the flute or the harp, do not give distinct notes, how will anyone know what is played? 8 And if the bugle gives an indistinct sound, who will get ready for battle? 9 So with yourselves, if with your tongue you utter speech that is not intelligible, how will anyone know what is said? For you will be speaking into the air. 10 There are doubtless many different languages in the world, and none is without meaning, 11 but if I do not know the meaning of the language, I will be a foreigner to the speaker and the speaker a foreigner to me. 12 So with yourselves, since you are eager for manifestations of the Spirit, strive to excel in building up the church.
13 Therefore, one who speaks in a tongue should pray for the power to interpret. 14 For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays but my mind is unfruitful. 15 What am I to do? I will pray with my spirit, but I will pray with my mind also; I will sing praise with my spirit, but I will sing with my mind also. 16 Otherwise, if you give thanks with your spirit, how can anyone in the position of an outsider say “Amen” to your thanksgiving when he does not know what you are saying? 17 For you may be giving thanks well enough, but the other person is not being built up. 18 I thank God that I speak in tongues more than all of you. 19 Nevertheless, in church I would rather speak five words with my mind in order to instruct others, than ten thousand words in a tongue. (1 Cor. 14)

TK,
I think you are misconstruing Paul. Paul is not necessarily describing his personal behavior. (Notice He says "if I pray in a tongue" rather than "when I pray in a tongue.") Paul is adopting the first person to instruct the Corinthians how they should behave in the assembly. To be a benefit in the assembly, one must speak the language that people understand. That is Paul's point in all of the chapter.
I think the idea of a devotional prayer language is another misunderstanding of Paul's point. Regardless of how many Christians practice it, their experience does not determine the meaning of Paul's words.

[TK]

I thank God that I speak in tongues more than all of you. Nevertheless, in church I would rather speak five words with my mind in order to instruct others, than ten thousand words in a tongue.

Paul says he speak in tongues all the time... but not in church. When, then, is he doing this speaking in tongues? And why would he do so, if not to edify himself? The gist I get is that speaking in tongues should be more of a private thing, or with a few like minded believers, but not in the general assembly. I certainly agree with this. I have been in some services where someone breaks out in a tongue, and even when there is an interpretation I still am a little queasy about it. I personally would prefer that it not happen in a church service.

TK

[Homer]

Hi TK,

You wrote:

Paul says he speak in tongues all the time... but not in church. When, then, is he doing this speaking in tongues? And why would he do so, if not to edify himself?

As the paper by Glenn Peoples shows, "tongues" aren't some mysterious thing, but are simply languages or dialects. What if Paul had elaborated and said "I speak more languages than all of you for I speak Greek, Hebrew, Aramaic, and also the Alexandrian dialect. When I'm in church I speak the common language of those there"?

It seems to me quite a stretch to find private use of a spiritual gift considering the following:

1 Corinthians 12
New American Standard Bible (NASB)

4. Now there are varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit. 5. And there are varieties of ministries, and the same Lord. 6. There are varieties of effects, but the same God who works all things in all persons. 7. But to each one is given the manifestation of the Spirit for the common good.

Ephesians 4:11-13
New American Standard Bible (NASB)

11. And He gave some as apostles, and some as prophets, and some as evangelists, and some as pastors and teachers, 12. for the equipping of the saints for the work of service, to the building up of the body of Christ; 13. until we all attain to the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a mature man, to the measure of the stature which belongs to the fullness of Christ.

"Tongues" have undergone quite a change among charismatics since Azusa Street. It has mostly gone from a sort of bona fides of Holy Spirit baptism and now into the closet. And all with very little in the scriptures to go on. How many verses are there regarding "private prayer language"? One or maybe two indirect comments? As Peoples points out, experience interprets scriptures.