New Book - Pure Pleasure (free pdf download)

[darinhouston]

Free download for a while at http://www.garythomas.com/-- I'm reading it and have some thoughts - would love to hear yours.

This man preaches at our church frequently.

[Jason]

Darin, I downloaded the book and will give my thoughts when I finished it. What is your impression of the material?

[Suzana]

I downloaded the book also & have read the first few chapters (then became pre-occupied with other things).
I do intend to continue reading eventually – I think I probably do need to adjust my own attitude to a more healthier one in some things:
I recall when I read this:

"Prayer and fellowship are among life’s richest pleasures, but let’s
not stop there. Let us learn to fill our souls with beauty, art, noble
achievement, fine meals, rich relationships, and soul-cleansing
laughter."

I was startled to find myself instinctively reacting negatively to the idea of enjoying “fine meals” being legitimate pleasure – this is weird, because if someone asked me I would have said it was an OK thing to do, and I like nice food. I should probably explore what wrong attitudes, or perhaps latent guilt feelings I have to get this reaction.
I don't mean to indulge in deep navel-gazing, but at least intend to read the book (eventually) which will hopefully help to crystallise some things.

[darinhouston]

I'm reluctant to opine til you've read it (or til I've completed it), but from the parts I've read, from hearing his sermon, and from skimming the rest, here's how I responded to a friend who asked me the same thing (and who also asked if he cited any scripture).

Yes, I'd say there are more than your average number of scriptural references for a modern evangelical "practical Christian living" book like this -- I haven't read it all yet (it's pretty short), but I think what's needed more than additional scriptural references is a final chapter or Epilogue to balance against the even larger tendency today of "secularizing" Christian life in a way to simply displace worldly pleasures with Christian counterparts -- the key to me is to learn to praise God in the enjoyment of all that we do in this world and not to seek pleasure itself as an end (especially stimulation/excitement), even if it's "clean" or "permissible" pleasure, and even if we can manage to do so in a way that we are still thankful of God.

The book would have been more timely a couple of decades ago when Christians seem to have had an almost gnostic view of Christian life (though they didn't necessarily live like it) -- however, I think the more important book today would be about understanding pleasure and guarding against overdoing it or mistaking other things for a godly pleasure -- Christians today actually seem to have no problem seeking pleasure, and they've justified much of it by making it seem holy. The risk today I think is our immersing ourselves in "stimulating" activities (even at church) while losing the capability to truly find pleasure in things like relationships and helping others and a sunset or rainstorm or front porch conversations, watching kids play, seeing and sharing answered prayer, etc.

His larger point, though, is excellent and somewhat novel -- the notion about the unexpected danger of depriving ones-self of pleasure, and the tendency to seek it elsewhere if you're not getting it from the permissible aspects of the "world." However, the missing element hinted at above is the risk that by continuing to stimulate our pleasure centers (even with "Christian" pleasures), we can lose the ability to find pleasure in the little things around us (including quietly meditating on things of God) and the same risks can exist even in the midst of seemingly pleasurable activities which constantly stimulate (or even overload) our senses. Basically, we have lost the ability to distinguish and properly value "pleasurable" things over merely "stimulating" things.

All in all, though - he provided a pretty good balance (the above being a particularly sensitive subject to me), and it is a pretty good treatment of "pleasure" in the life of a Christian.

[TK]

Darin- Have you read "desiring God" by John Piper? In it he lays out his case for what he calls "christian hedonism." I dont have time right now to read the book you are discussing, but I wonder if it is a similar concept.

TK

[darinhouston]

Darin- Have you read "desiring God" by John Piper? In it he lays out his case for what he calls "christian hedonism." I dont have time right now to read the book you are discussing, but I wonder if it is a similar concept.

TK

If this article by Piper on the subject is indicative,

http://www.desiringgod.org/ResourceLibr ... _Hedonism/

it seems a related but corollary concept - I think I actually agree more with Piper's perspective on this one. Piper seems to say the result of obeying God is that this is how we'll incidentally experience our highest pleasure, and so doing God's will is the ultimate aim. He's quick to point out we shouldn't obey God for the reason of our happiness, but that this is the result because we were wired for doing His will. That's a bit different from this book, which suggests we are less likely to seek immoral pleasures if we are fully partaking of the permissible pleasures of the world, and that to deprive us of all things "secular" will result in a void that we'll ultimately be likely to satisfy in a frantic gulp of immorality.

[TK]

interesting- i am going to have to read this book the first chance i get.

In Piper's view the first tenet of the Westminster Catechism should be changed from "Man's chief end is to glorify God, and to enjoy him forever" to "Man's chief end is to glorify God BY ENJOYING him forever."

It is a subtle, but significant change.

From what I remember from Desiring God (its been a long time) he is saying something quite different from what Thomas is saying, although I am intrigued to read more of what Thomas has to say.

TK