What makes a marriage?

[livingink]

Well, the subject is pretty much it. What makes a marriage? What is required by God for two people to be considered married? Of course, it's not a "marriage license" granted by the state. But what is the minimum requirement?

Example: if two people (let's use teenagers for this example) commit to each other for life before God and then sleep together. They can walk away from each other the next day and never speak a word to each other and no one would consider them "divorced." But does God?

What makes two people husband and wife?

[Guest]

Example: if two people (let's use teenagers for this example) commit to each other for life before God and then sleep together. They can walk away from each other the next day and never speak a word to each other and no one would consider them "divorced." But does God?

What makes two people husband and wife?

I would say that a public declaration of commitment of a couple before people that know them and can hold them accountable would make them married before God (ideally fellow disciples of Christ with whom a couple fellowships).
The purposes of a marriage ceremony is
a) to make a public declaration of a commitment by which you can be held accountable
b) to express your love and lifelong commitment for each other
c) to show the world that both people are "off the market"

A secret commitment accomplishes none of these and shows an attitude by one or both persons that they aren't truly interested in marriage.

What do you think?

Dave

[livingink]

I agree that those are the purposes of a marriage ceremony and I think they are great. I guess my question is more of, what is the bare minimum according to Scripture (if there is any). What is acceptable in the eyes of God as a marriage? Is it only if you call someone your husband/wife? If you view them as such and they view you as such?

[Guest]

Example: if two people (let's use teenagers for this example) commit to each other for life before God and then sleep together. They can walk away from each other the next day and never speak a word to each other and no one would consider them "divorced." But does God?

What makes two people husband and wife?

My position is that genuine life-long commitment is the essence of marriage, and that your example would be an instance of genuine marriage. I knew of a couple of missionaries who decided to get married, but the country in which they were ministering would permit legal marriage only to Catholics. But the couple considered it wrong to become Catholics only in order to become married, as so they decided to commit themselves to each other for life ---- before God. There is no doubt in my mind that they had become truly married in the eyes of God.

I believe this to be the correct understanding of the state of being married. However, it is also important to understand that the verb "marry" both in the New Testament and in other early Christian writings sometimes means ONLY "having sexual intercourse."

[Guest]

But the couple considered it wrong to become Catholics only in order to become married, as so they decided to commit themselves to each other for life ---- before God. There is no doubt in my mind that they had become truly married in the eyes of God


Good example but i think since we are called to obey the civil authorities except in rare cases then biblical marriage would follow the marriage requirements of the secular government we live in unless the requirements were blatently ungodly.

[livingink]

However, it is also important to understand that the verb "marry" both in the New Testament and in other early Christian writings sometimes means ONLY "having sexual intercourse."

Could you give me some examples? I have never heard this and am curious. Thanks!

[Guest]

Here are some of the clearest examples:

From Eusebius (260 – 340 A.D) Church History
At this time the so-called sect of the Nicolaitans made its appearance and lasted for a very short time. Mention is made of it in the Apocalypse of
John. They boasted that the author of their sect was Nicolaus, one of the
deacons who, with Stephen, were appointed by the apostles for the
purpose of ministering to the poor. Clement of Alexandria, in the third
book of his Stromata, relates the following things concerning him. “They
say that he had a beautiful wife, and after the ascension of the Savior, being accused by the apostles of jealousy, he led her into their midst and gave permission to any one that wished to marry her. For they say that this was in accord with that saying of his, that one ought to abuse the flesh. And those that have followed his heresy, imitating blindly and foolishly that which was done and said, commit fornication without shame. But I understand that Nicolaus had to do with no other woman than her to
whom he was married, and that, so far as his children are concerned, his
daughters continued in a state of virginity until old age, and his son
remained uncorrupt.

Eusebius quoted Clement of Alexandria in his description of what Nicolaus had supposedly done in allowing anyone who wished, to marry his wife. Eusebius apparently thought that Clement used the word “marry” appropriately, as referring to copulation. At the same time, Eusebius stated (see bolded quote) that “Nicolaus had to do with no other woman that her to whom he was married.” Is Eusebius using “married” in a different sense from that of his quote from Clement? Maybe; maybe not. When the nounal form of the word is used, it seems to mean, at the very least, a long-term relationship, both here and in the New Testament.


From Justin Martyr’s Discourse to the Greeks, last sentence of chapter 3:
For what need is there of speaking of the goad of Oedipus, and the murder of Laius, and the marrying his mother, and the mutual slaughter of those who were at once his brothers and his sons?

I know this is a story about a god. Nevertheless, I don’t think the story has him “marrying” his mother in the sense of forming a legal contract with her, or promising a permanent bond with her. Does the story of Oedipus in Greek mythology claim any deeper relationship between him and his mother other than sex?

Clement of Alexandria “Exhortation to the Heathen”, chapter 4
…and again that of Demetrius, who was raised to the rank of the gods; and where he alighted from his horse on his entrance into Athens is the temple of Demetrius the Alighter; and altars were raised to him everywhere, and nuptials with Athene assigned to him by the Athenians. But he disdained the goddess, as he could not marry the statue; and taking the courtesan Lamia, he ascended the Acropolis, and lay
with her on the couch of Athene, showing to the old virgin the postures of
the young courtesan.

In a future post, I hope to offer some NT uses of "marry" as also sometimes having the meaning of copulation. But the examples I will present, are not as clear as the above ones. However, understanding them as such, seems to throw a clearer light on the passages.

[livingink]

The verse that comes to my mind first is the one in 1 Cor 7:8 where Paul says about widows, "...But if they do not have self-control, let them marry; for it is better to marry than to burn with passion."

And then again in 28, "But if you marry, you have not sinned; and if a virgin marries, she has not sinned. Yet such will have trouble ("tribulation in the flesh") in this life, and I am trying to spare you."

I can't imagine either of these verses just talking about copulation.

The way that I have always thought about it is the you can't have a marriage without copulation (it is not a marriage), but copulation does not equal a marriage.

The implications of getting married through copulation alone, with an immature commitment to one another has some serious consequences. I have a good friend who, before she came to know the Lord was very sexually active. After coming to know the Lord, she found a wonderful Godly man and they have been married now for several years. If marrying just means copulating, then she was married several times (and I guess consequently divorced several times). So the question would be, is she now living in adultery? Of course, I'm sure all of those guys have "married" another, so then she would be released I guess.

[Guest]

Good example but i think since we are called to obey the civil authorities except in rare cases then biblical marriage would follow the marriage requirements of the secular government we live in unless the requirements were blatently ungodly.

Why?

I don't see anywhere in Scripture where God places marriage as a government institution. The governments of this world have no business regulating, restricting, changing or giving permission for marriage.

Dave

[Guest]

Perhaps you misunderstood me. I was speaking of the way the Greek word seems to be used in its various parts of speech.

I have not suggested that "being married" and "marriage" are used in the New Testament as merely copulation. They are, in the very least, long term relationships, and, as I see it, according to God's intention for humanity, they ought to be life-long commitments.

What I was saying is that the verb "marry" was sometimes used to mean mere copulation. I have given examples in the the writings of the church fathers. Did you find the examples insufficient to be convincing?

In the New Testament, consider the following:

Mark 6:17 For Herod had sent and seized John, and bound him in prison for the sake of Herodias, his brother Philip’s wife; because he had married her.

Could Herod have married (in the modern sense of the word) Philip's wife?
She was already married to Philip.

Or had she been divorced from Philip? But if that were the case, then why had John been reprimanding Herod for marrying her?