How good and how pleasant...

_Perry
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri Apr 28, 2006 5:50 pm

Post by _Perry » Mon Jun 25, 2007 4:00 pm

Steve wrote: The "shame" in the verse is clearly speaking of popular sentiment in Corinith…
What does he mean my “nature itself teach[ing]”? That seems to go beyond local Corinthian sensibilities.

I realize this sounds like ultra-conservative fundamentalism, but that’s not where I’m coming from. There’s a great deal in this passage I don’t understand. Verse 10 is utterly baffling to me, and I’m certainly not of the mindset that women must keep their heads covered at all times.
Steve wrote: Okay, okay, already! "...must go faster, must go faster..." —There! How did that sound?
See?!? Who can deny that sounded exactly like Jeff Goldblum?

I rest my case. :wink:

Perry
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:

User avatar
_Steve
Posts: 1564
Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2004 12:07 am
Location: Santa Cruz, CA

Post by _Steve » Mon Jun 25, 2007 5:36 pm

In what sense does "nature" teach that it is a shame for a man to have "long hair"?

First, it is not something obvious from human biology, since "nature" will grow a man's hair as long as it will grow a woman's.

Second, it is not taught in the animal kingdom, since it is often the males (and not the females) that have the fancy plummage and embellishments (e.g., peacocks; lions).

Third, there is nothing in the nature of man that would make shame a universal, transcultural reaction to long hair, since many cultures, including earlier European and American cultures, had long hair (and even wigs) as the normal style for men, who apparently felt no embarrassment about it.

Fourth, there is nothing in the godly nature of the righteous that makes long hair and men covering their heads universally shameful, since the priests were commanded by God to wear a mitre on their heads while ministering, and nazirites were required to have their hair long as a part of their piety.

So, in what sense, then, could Paul mean this? In my opinion, it is parallel to saying, "Doesn't nature itself tell you (i.e., doesn't it seem unnatural) that a man should not wear a woman's undergarments and lipstick?" There is a law that forbids cross-dressing (Deut.22:5). A godly person (and even most ungodly people) would find transvestism "unnatural" and disgusting. In a society where long hair was strictly a feminine style (like Corinth, but not like Israel), this sense of unnaturalness would accrue to a man wearing his hair like a woman's.

Each society has different norms governing male a female dress. Some say it is a sin for a woman to wear pants, since this was, at one time a man's style. Similarly, short hair, until a generation ago, was regarded to be distinctly a man's style in America, as it was in Corinth. In such societies, a man ought not wear long hair, and a woman ought not to wear pants. However, our society no longer defines those particulars as being gender-specific.
Last edited by FAST WebCrawler [Crawler] on Mon Jun 25, 2007 7:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason:
In Jesus,
Steve

_Perry
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri Apr 28, 2006 5:50 pm

Post by _Perry » Mon Jun 25, 2007 5:51 pm

Thanks Steve.

The lipstick analogy was illuminating. I imagine that Joseph may have worn quite a bit of make-up once he became Vizzier(sp?) of Egypt. What looked quite normal in that culture would probably have looked more like Boy-George (plumb not natural) to us today.

Perry
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:

User avatar
_Derek
Posts: 291
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2005 12:27 am
Location: Marietta GA

Post by _Derek » Mon Jun 25, 2007 10:22 pm

If I'd seen Derek as a stranger on the street, I'm sure I would have misjudged him as a skinhead. I say that to MY shame, and not his. Please understand I hold Derek in highest regard. He’s a heck of a guy. I'm certainly in no position to take any moral high-ground. Back in the day when I had hair, I would often let it get rather long, but that was more because I was lazy about hair-cuts than anything else.
Yeah. I actually had shoulder length hair when I shaved it all off ten years ago. Haven't paid for a haircut since.

I just can't stand having hair now. It's itchy.

God bless,
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:
Derek

Some trust in chariots, and some in horses: but we will remember the name of the LORD our God.
Psalm 20:7

User avatar
_brody_in_ga
Posts: 237
Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2005 8:55 pm
Location: Richland Ga

Post by _brody_in_ga » Thu Jun 28, 2007 10:29 am

I used to have long hair back in the day(being a rock star requires such) :twisted:

But now I keep it short and sweet. It seems to fit me better.
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:
For our God is a consuming fire.
Hebrews 12:29

_MLH
Posts: 74
Joined: Sun Jul 30, 2006 3:13 pm

Post by _MLH » Thu Jul 05, 2007 1:14 am

Brody,,, Seriously, were you a rock star? Well I am asking as my son
( wont tell his name) is writing and producing a CD..( guitar player)
rock n roll, UGH, raised a christian...PLS pray for him...
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:

User avatar
_brody_in_ga
Posts: 237
Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2005 8:55 pm
Location: Richland Ga

Post by _brody_in_ga » Sun Jul 08, 2007 3:17 pm

Hi MLH,

I have played in various bands, but when I say rock star, I am being light hearted (as usual.)

Why does your son need prayer? Do you think that a Christian should not listen to rock music? Or is he participating in a life style that sometimes comes along with the rock star gig?

God bless.
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:
For our God is a consuming fire.
Hebrews 12:29

_MLH
Posts: 74
Joined: Sun Jul 30, 2006 3:13 pm

Post by _MLH » Sun Jul 08, 2007 6:04 pm

thank you for your reply Brody...

I came out of the 60's era and the "Doors" were popular. Looking back they were mild in comparison to todays ROCK.......He needs prayer
to come out of the lifestyle and salvation...

Pls tell me how you feel about a christian listening to rock...Ok,
I admit, I like the oldies sometimes...
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:

User avatar
_brody_in_ga
Posts: 237
Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2005 8:55 pm
Location: Richland Ga

Post by _brody_in_ga » Sun Jul 08, 2007 10:22 pm

MLH wrote:thank you for your reply Brody...

I came out of the 60's era and the "Doors" were popular. Looking back they were mild in comparison to todays ROCK.......He needs prayer
to come out of the lifestyle and salvation...

Pls tell me how you feel about a christian listening to rock...Ok,
I admit, I like the oldies sometimes...
Hey MLH,

I will certainly pray for your situation. As to the subject of music, I am an avid music lover, who listens to many kinds of music. I understand that Christians don't all agree as to what is acceptable in the sight of the Lord, so I can only speak for myself and say that I believe that as long as a song does not glorify satan/demons, it does not bother me to listen to it. There are many gifted musicians who do not know Jesus, and probably have no desire to, but this does not negate that fact that they are brilliant instrumentalist. I am moved when singers and song writers sing of hard times and all the other issues that life can toss at you. James Taylor wrote a song called "Fire and rain", this song was written in reflection of his terrible bout with depression, and never ceases to move me. I can also listen to songs written by men who passionatly profess their emptyness in regards to this life and feel compassion, and realize the fact that I was once there. There is of course another aspect to music, it is a two edged sword. Certain bands can "get into your head" and cause all sorts bad thoughts. I try to avoid such. You must also(I believe)be careful not offend another Brother on this subject. I don't listen to much music around my Brothers and Sisters in Christ, because they may only like Hymns. I try to avoid any discussion on the matter in the church, as there are many opinions on this subject. So in conclusion, I think the what the Apostle Paul worte regarding food has much bearing on the current subject.
12 All things are lawful for me, but all things are not helpful. All things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any. 13 Foods for the stomach and the stomach for foods, but God will destroy both it and them...

And

14Receive one who is weak in the faith, but not to disputes over doubtful things. 2 For one believes he may eat all things, but he who is weak eats only vegetables. 3 Let not him who eats despise him who does not eat, and let not him who does not eat judge him who eats; for God has received him. 4 Who are you to judge another's servant? To his own master he stands or falls. Indeed, he will be made to stand, for God is able to make him stand.


12 So then each of us shall give account of himself to God. 13 Therefore let us not judge one another anymore, but rather resolve this, not to put a stumbling block or a cause to fall in our brother's way.

God bless.
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:
For our God is a consuming fire.
Hebrews 12:29

User avatar
_Christopher
Posts: 437
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2005 5:35 pm
Location: Gladstone, Oregon

Post by _Christopher » Sun Jul 08, 2007 11:26 pm

Brody wrote:
There are many gifted musicians who do not know Jesus, and probably have no desire to, but this does not negate that fact that they are brilliant instrumentalist. I am moved when singers and song writers sing of hard times and all the other issues that life can toss at you. James Taylor wrote a song called "Fire and rain", this song was written in reflection of his terrible bout with depression, and never ceases to move me.
JT wrote:
Won't you look down upon me Jesus....
Are you sure he doesn't know Jesus? May be wishful thinking on my part. I like JT's stuff a lot.
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:
"If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free." John 8:31-32

Post Reply

Return to “Prayer, Praise & Testimonies”