GEORGE'S GEMS

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Paidion
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GEORGE'S GEMS

Post by Paidion » Mon Dec 26, 2016 9:53 pm

George MacDonald wrote:People that only care to be saved, this is, not to be punished for their sins, are anxious only about themselves, not about God and His glory at all. They talk about the glory of God, but they make it consist in pure selfishness! According to them, He seeks everything for Himself; which is dead against the truth of God, a diabolic slander of God. It does not trouble them to believe such things about God'; they do not even desire that God should not be like that; they only want to escape Him. They dare not say that God will not do this or that, however clear it be that it would not be fair; they are in terror of contradicting the Bible. They make more of the Bible than of God, and so fail to find the truth of the Bible, and accept things concerning God which are not in the Bible, and are the greatest of insults to Him!
The Elect Lady, Chapter XXXII
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Homer
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Re: GEORGE'S GEMS

Post by Homer » Mon Dec 26, 2016 11:08 pm

They make more of the Bible than of God, and so fail to find the truth of the Bible, and accept things concerning God which are not in the Bible, and are the greatest of insults to Him!
I thought the issue concerned things that are in the bible which are claimed to be false. Joshua's conquests, God sending the flood, God striking down Herod, etc., etc., are in all the several translations I possess. What translation did MacDonald read?

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Re: GEORGE'S GEMS

Post by Paidion » Tue Dec 27, 2016 1:05 am

George MacDonald wrote:To say on the authority of the Bible that God does a thing no honourable man would do, is to lie against God; to say that it is therefore right, is to lie against the very spirit of God.
— George MacDonald; Unspoken Sermons III, Justice
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Re: GEORGE'S GEMS

Post by Paidion » Tue Dec 27, 2016 11:34 am

George MacDonald died in 1905, and so had died prior to the Communist revolution in Russia. However, communist thinking existed long before the revolution. Here are GMD's thoughts:
George MacDonald wrote:When I see a man lifting up those that are beneath him, not pulling down those that are above him, I will believe in his communism."
Perhaps had he lived in our day, GMD might have said:
When I see a man lifting up those that are beneath him, instead of lifting himself up, I will believe in his capitalism.
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steve7150
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Re: GEORGE'S GEMS

Post by steve7150 » Tue Dec 27, 2016 7:14 pm

Perhaps had he lived in our day, GMD might have said:

When I see a man lifting up those that are beneath him, instead of lifting himself up, I will believe in his capitalism.






Communism lifts up no one , not the one beneath you, not you and not anyone. Capitalism at least provides hope and opportunity for many. It's far from perfect but it's the best political system IMHO.
Also communism likes to crush any dissent so for example one of the first things Stalin did was starve to death the middle class private farmers in the Ukraine so he could impose collectivism to farms and initiate his workers paradise vision.

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Re: GEORGE'S GEMS

Post by Paidion » Wed Dec 28, 2016 12:00 am

Many have said that Stalinism was a perversion of Marxism. They say that Marxist theory, has never put into practice. If it were, there would be a more equitable distribution of wealth, and thus it would be "lifting up those that are beneath"— the communism that GMD declared he would support.

I believe in free enterprise. But I see capitalism as going far beyond that. Through the tactics of the super wealthy in a capitalist system, the super wealthy keep getting richer, while the poor and the middle class, not having the same opportunities, continue to get poorer. In a truly capitalist system,the wealth of the country becomes concentrated in the hands of the very wealthy. This does not happen in a country that is neither communist nor capitalist, but where free enterprise is practised.

However, "capitalism" is often defined as being pretty much tantamount to "free enterprise." If that is all that is meant by the word, then I do not oppose it. Even socialist countries (such as Canada) practise free enterprise.
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Re: GEORGE'S GEMS

Post by steve7150 » Wed Dec 28, 2016 9:00 am

Many have said that Stalinism was a perversion of Marxism. They say that Marxist theory, has never put into practice. If it were, there would be a more equitable distribution of wealth, and thus it would be "lifting up those that are beneath"— the communism that GMD declared he would support.








Marxism has been tried many times with the same result. Lenin tried it before Stalin took power and reverted the economy back to a mixed system because of the shortages of goods in Russia. It's been tried in Cambodia,Cuba,China,Vietnam and eastern Europe and other places. There was no incentive because what happens is you have some industrious people and some lazy people and some people in between and eventually the industrious people start losing motivation. Then the economic production starts declining to the lowest common denominator because hard working productive people become resentful and start getting resented by the rest out of envy. All the countries that tried Marxism were forced to move toward capitalism and now Cuba the last holdout is beginning to change.
The thing about Capitalism is that it creates wealth and you can debate about how much wealth the people at the top should be allowed to keep, but at least there is something to debate about.

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Re: GEORGE'S GEMS

Post by Paidion » Wed Dec 28, 2016 12:43 pm

Lenin's attempt was just as bad as Stalin's. Both used it to their own benefit, which was the opposite to the intentions of Marx.
The thing about Capitalism is that it creates wealth and you can debate about how much wealth the people at the top should be allowed to keep, but at least there is something to debate about.
Yes, as I understand Capitalism it creates wealth for the wealthy, whereas free enterprise creates opportunity for everyone. Thus in the latter case there would be nothing about which to debate (which is the result of fairness) except debating whether or not there was equal opportunity.

However, perhaps further discussion of political matters could be done in a separate thread. I would like to reserve this one exclusively for posting George's Gems.
Paidion

Man judges a person by his past deeds, and administers penalties for his wrongdoing. God judges a person by his present character, and disciplines him that he may become righteous.

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Re: GEORGE'S GEMS

Post by Paidion » Wed Dec 28, 2016 12:59 pm

George MacDonald wrote:God and man must combine for salvation from sin, and the same word, here and elsewhere translated as remission seems to be employed in the New Testament for the share of either in the great deliverance.
Hope of the Gospel 27
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Man judges a person by his past deeds, and administers penalties for his wrongdoing. God judges a person by his present character, and disciplines him that he may become righteous.

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Re: GEORGE'S GEMS

Post by Jepne » Wed Dec 28, 2016 3:07 pm

There is so much food for thought in these quotations, they leave me with not much to say.

I wish there was a 'like' button.
"Anything you think you know about God that you can't find in the person of Jesus, you have reason to question.” - anonymous

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