Israel's Sovereignty Question

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Steelwheels
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Israel's Sovereignty Question

Post by Steelwheels » Sun Oct 21, 2012 11:58 pm

In 606 BC, Israel went into captivity in Babylon, did the nation ever regain it’s sovereignty?
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Paidion
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Re: Israel's Sovereignty Question

Post by Paidion » Mon Oct 22, 2012 7:15 pm

Yes. In 1948.
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Re: Israel's Sovereignty Question

Post by steve7150 » Mon Oct 22, 2012 7:50 pm

In 606 BC, Israel went into captivity in Babylon, did the nation ever regain it’s sovereignty




Is this a trick question?

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Steelwheels
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Re: Israel's Sovereignty Question

Post by Steelwheels » Mon Oct 22, 2012 9:04 pm

Not at all. A brother wants to move to Israel so he can be there when "things start to happen." I asked him what things and his reasoning is that since Israel lost it's "sovereignty" in 606, the OT references to the nation apply to modern times. I disagree but I'm not sure how to address him.
Not a trick question, just my ignorance on the subject.
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Steelwheels
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Re: Israel's Sovereignty Question

Post by Steelwheels » Mon Oct 22, 2012 9:55 pm

I guess I was not very clear. My bad. Between 606BC and 70AD did the nation ever regain their sovereignty fully? Or were they just allowed to exist as they did under the Roman rule?
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Marcus
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Re: Israel's Sovereignty Question

Post by Marcus » Mon Oct 22, 2012 11:18 pm

Steelwheels wrote:I guess I was not very clear. My bad. Between 606BC and 70AD did the nation ever regain their sovereignty fully? Or were they just allowed to exist as they did under the Roman rule?
I would say that the Jews did regain their sovereignty during the Maccabean period, when they successfully fought off Greek domination (the Seleucids) and were independent until the Romans took over their sovereignty with the coming of the Roman general Pompey in 63 BC.

They were a client state from 606 BC under the Babylonians, and then under the Persians and the Greeks successively, had a little over a century of independence under the Maccabean rulers from 167 BC to 63 BC, and then again became a client state, this time under Rome.

I am not aware if the Maccabean priest-kings paid tribute to any other rulers before the Romans. You can find out more information about this period at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hasmonean_dynasty, which has a pretty fair description of the period.

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steve7150
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Re: Israel's Sovereignty Question

Post by steve7150 » Tue Oct 23, 2012 8:34 pm

Not at all. A brother wants to move to Israel so he can be there when "things start to happen." I asked him what things and his reasoning is that since Israel lost it's "sovereignty" in 606, the OT references to the nation apply to modern times. I disagree but I'm not sure how to address him.
Not a trick question, just my ignorance on the subject







I may be the only one at this forum that believes that Psalm 83 is currently beginning to be fully effectuated against Israel through the "Arab Spring " which may allow
Islamists to ultimately try to destroy Israel.

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Re: Israel's Sovereignty Question

Post by Marcus » Tue Oct 23, 2012 8:59 pm

steve7150 wrote:I may be the only one at this forum that believes that Psalm 83 is currently beginning to be fully effectuated against Israel through the "Arab Spring " which may allow Islamists to ultimately try to destroy Israel.
So you don't think Psalm 83 already happened in biblical times? Or do you grant that and also see a secondary fulfillment in our times?

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Re: Israel's Sovereignty Question

Post by Steelwheels » Wed Oct 24, 2012 12:27 am

Thanks Marcus, that gives me a direction to research a little.
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Re: Israel's Sovereignty Question

Post by steve7150 » Wed Oct 24, 2012 10:48 am

So you don't think Psalm 83 already happened in biblical times? Or do you grant that and also see a secondary fulfillment in our times?





I don't think Israel's enemies ever planned simultaneously to attack and wipe out Israel in the past. They attacked separately at varying times over a few centuries but today then can simultaneously launch a missile attack on Israel in the near future if they choose to. In the recent past the Arab dictators wanted to hold onto their own power but now with these new Isalmist governments emerging it's possible. Should be interesting what happens with Syria.

"They have said , Come and let us wipe them out as a nation, that the name of Israel be remembered no more." Psalm 83.4

"For they have conspired together with one mind against you they make a covenant." 83.5


Then at least nine nations are named which today are Islamic countries and surround Israel so i think it's a likely scenario.

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