The Narrow Path Ministries

Hi,my name is Paul,from Portland.Some call me Zeke.I have a question.I have been listening and reading Tozer and was wondering if he was a Calvinist or Armenian,anyone know?


Thanks to all,God bless!

He was a CMA preacher. I remember a quote from him that said when he prays, he's a Calvinist, when he preaches, he's an Arminian.

Christopher is correct. In some of Tozer's recorded sermons, though, I was surprised to hear him speak very harshly against the distinctive Calvinistic doctrines (I wasn't surprised that he wasn't Calvinistic, but I was surprised by the vehemence of his criticism of them). I don't recall that he mentions the word "Calvinism," but he certainly identified the doctrines that he found so abhorrent.

Greetings --

I've been going *nuts* trying to find an AWT sermon in which he directly addressed Calvinism and Arminianism (got lost it in a putr crash last Spring)....

After giving up (more or less)....
I recalled some AWT's from Steve's home page (@ digital minstries link).
So, went there and bingo! Found it!
AWT: The Sovereignty of God

Not sure when it was recorded but --- AWT opened up with ---
"I'm going to do something today that no man in his right mind ought to try to do...[insert audience laughter]...I'm going to preach on the sovereignty of God...[insert more audience laughter]....".

Actually, I had sent this sermon to a Calvinist lady I met on a dating site.
It didn't win me many brownie points...[needless to say]...started a Huge Debate, in fact.
But I 'backed down' and agreed to disagree, LOL
(Wasn't trying to start an argument to "impress" her)....
At any rate, not long later, she met and married a Calvinist guy ===>
=========================================================

Add-On AWT quote from Wesleyan Arminian ---

Here is a great quote by A.W. Tozer on the sovereignty of God:

"God sovereignly decreed that man should be free to exercise moral choice, and man from the beginning has fulfilled that decree by making his choice between good and evil. When he chooses to do evil, he does not thereby countervail the sovereign will of God but fulfills it, inasmuch as the eternal decree decided not which choice the man should make but that he should be free to make it. If in His absolute freedom God has willed to give man limited freedom, who is there to stay His hand or say, “What doest thou?” Man’s will is free because God is sovereign. A God less than sovereign could not bestow moral freedom upon His creatures. He would be afraid to do so."

A.W. Tozer, The Knowledge of the Holy, chapter 22 "The Sovereignty of God".

I have a question that I have been searching for an answer with no luck.I understand that jews don't believe that Jesus is the Messiah or God incarnate.I get that they believe only in the old testament or the Tora.What I don't get is why.I have searched the net and asked those Thought might know. It is so obvious that if one reads the entire Bible,including of course the new testament,that anyone who doesn't believe and accept that Jesus is the Messiah and died for our sins is not saved and all the religious ceremonies are a complete waste of time.Why in the world cannot jews see this? These people are not stupid,I have heard Micheal Medved speak many times.He is very articulate,well spoken and smart.Why in the world can he not see the problems with his belief?I don't get it,any help would be much appreciated.

My quick answer as to why Jews (or any non-Christians) do not believe in Christ is simply this: faith is a gift from God. Therefore, it is possible for a man, even a very intelligent and educated man, to not believe in Christ (if he either has not been offered the gift; or if he has been offered it, but rejected the gift).

Recall what Christ said to His apostles regarding their belief in Him. In the 16th chapter of the Gospel according to Matthew, after Peter made his confession of faith in Christ, Jesus responded to Peter by saying, "Blessed are you Simon, son of John, because it was not flesh and blood that revealed this to you, but My heavenly Father." (Matthew 16:17) Further, Paul asks us, "What have you that you have not received? But if you received it, why do you boast as if you have not received?" (1 Cor. 4:7) We Christians have RECEIVED Faith in Christ from our heavenly Father; this was not our own doing, but the gift of God. We should, as Paul says, give thanks always to God, especially for this gift of Faith....and pray that others-- whether they be Jews, Moslims, or whomever-- also receive this gift from God to believe in Christ as their Lord, God, Savior, and Friend (cf. Jn. 15:5).

RickC,

Thank you very much for posting this. It is beautiful! Reading it is a blessing.

"God sovereignly decreed that man should be free to exercise moral choice, and man from the beginning has fulfilled that decree by making his choice between good and evil. When he chooses to do evil, he does not thereby countervail the sovereign will of God but fulfills it, inasmuch as the eternal decree decided not which choice the man should make but that he should be free to make it. If in His absolute freedom God has willed to give man limited freedom, who is there to stay His hand or say, “What doest thou?” Man’s will is free because God is sovereign. A God less than sovereign could not bestow moral freedom upon His creatures. He would be afraid to do so."

I have never read Tozer. I did listen to a few minutes of one of his sermons (downloaded from digital ministries) a couple of years ago. I will be looking into Tozer.

Thanks again,

Candlepower

zeke wrote:Why in the world cannot jews see this? These people are not stupid,I have heard Micheal Medved speak many times.He is very articulate,well spoken and smart.Why in the world can he not see the problems with his belief?I don't get it...

Zeke,

Good question. The dilemma you present used to bother me a lot, and I used to ask the same question repeatedly: "Why in the world..." don't they believe? Why and how do some not believe what I found to be so obviously true? In fact, that dilemma is what convinced me to accept Augustine/Calvinism in my earlier days as a Christian. Those men theorized that God had created some people to go to heaven, and had created all the rest to go to hell. I concluded back then, "The reason some don't believe is because God created them without the ability to believe. He didn't give them faith. That solves my dilemma!" That's what I believed before I learned how wrong Augustine and Calvin were. Their theory just doesn't agree with Scripture. Which is no wonder. It's partly paganism.

Augustine was never able to shake off the doctrine of fatalism he had learned from the pagan religion he held prior to becoming a Christian. Instead, he morphed a new gospel from fatalism and Scripture (google The Fates, and fatalism). Augustine was more a philosopher than a theologian. Fatalism, like Augustinianism (and Calvinism), negates the clear teachings in the Bible that God has granted to man a degree of genuine free will (please see RickC's post above). True to his fatalistic underpinnings, Augustine (and later Calvin) depicted man as a puppet whose every move is dictated by God. Fate/God dictates man's every thought and action. Fate/God, therefore, is responsible for everything that happens -- the good & the bad -- every robbery and every rape.

Before I rejected Augustine & Calvin's fatalism, I concluded that faith was a gift given to only certain people. It was some people's fate to be given faith; it was some people's fate not to be given faith. Faith and salvation, therfore, was a matter of fate. Man had no say in it.

I reject that pagan notion. Faith (the ability to believe) is a gift given to everyone. It is part of what makes us human. Faith is nothing more than believing. We all have the ability to believe, and we all exercise belief (faith) all the time. In Spring, when the apple tree is in blossom, do you believe those blossoms will produce apples and not acorns in the fall? Yes you do, even though you see only the blossoms now. Do you believe that if you get on a bus headed for Pittsburgh that you will probably arrive in Pittsburgh, and not Miami? Yes you do. When you go to bed at night, do you believe the sun will probably rise in the morning? Of course you do. You even set your alarm clock in anticipation of the new day you expect (believe) will arrive. A long, long list could be made of examples of how every one of us exercises faith all the time.

One verse that convinced me that I had gotten in with the wrong crowd is 2 Peter 3:9 "The Lord is...not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance." Because God desires all to come to repentance, why would He give faith only to some and not to others? The answer is, He wouldn't, and He hasn't. All are free to trust Christ. "Whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved." What He does give to some and not to others is grace. Those who trust Him, He graciously saves. Those who don't trust Him don't receive His grace. Ephesians 2:8 tells us, "For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God." I believe this verse tells us that salvation, not faith, is the gift of God. Believing is something we all do. Choosing to believe in the Lord Jesus is what we must to receive His grace.

The difference between the Christian and the non-Christian is not a matter of luck or fate (the lucky guy got the faith, the loser didn't). The difference is that one has chosen to place his faith Christ and the other has chosen to place his faith in something else. Both have faith, but in different things.

I understand your frustration, Zeke. It still frustrates me that folks choose to reject the truth that is so obvious to you and me. I no longer believe that the reason they don't believe is because they are doomed by their fate (chosen to go to hell), as Augustine & Calvin thought. I now realize that the reason they don't believe the truth is simply because they have voluntarily chosen not to. God has given them that liberty. It grieves us that they choose wrongly.

We need to pray not that God will give them faith, but that they will choose to exercise their faith by trusting Christ.

God bless you,

Candlepower

Thanks candlepower and brother Allen.This makes perfect sense and helps a lot.I too have come from a Calvinist background and have discarded it in favor of Arminianism. By the way,I attended an open forum on Saturday and wonderful sermon by Steve in Camas,Washington on Sunday.All very enjoyable.Thanks again.God bless.