How important is church membership?

Post Reply
User avatar
_Seth
Posts: 59
Joined: Thu Aug 31, 2006 4:36 pm
Location: Hillsboro, OR

How important is church membership?

Post by _Seth » Wed Jul 16, 2008 11:50 am

A friend at church linked this blog entry by John Piper on church membership. I think he makes some good points but ultimately fails to support his overall pro-membership message with solid Scripture.

How Important is Church Membership?

Thoughts? It seems to me that the notion of needing church discipline is valid, but it's not like we're doing well with that while *having* this kind of view of membership. And it seems that, far from meeting Paul's "body" analogy, modern church membership further divides the body.
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:

User avatar
_Michelle
Posts: 379
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 9:59 am
Location: SoCal

Re: How important is church membership?

Post by _Michelle » Wed Jul 16, 2008 9:14 pm

Seth wrote:A friend at church linked this blog entry by John Piper on church membership. I think he makes some good points but ultimately fails to support his overall pro-membership message with solid Scripture.

How Important is Church Membership?

Thoughts? It seems to me that the notion of needing church discipline is valid, but it's not like we're doing well with that while *having* this kind of view of membership. And it seems that, far from meeting Paul's "body" analogy, modern church membership further divides the body.
Hi Seth,

This one's hard for me because just after Christmas my name was removed from the membership rolls of the last church I was a member of, and I don't have any immediate plans to join another church. I'm afraid that I may be justifying my position in what I have to say.

John Piper has made some really good points about what the church is meant to do with his "5 Strands." His point seems to be that without some type of formal membership that identifies each person as belonging to a particular assembly, there will some problem in fulfilling these obligations. Perhaps it's nice to have a list of members to make everything neat and tidy (I wouldn't understand because I've never been a list-keeper type person.) Is there a place in the New Testament where it tells leaders to keep careful records of who is in and who is out?

Piper's first strand is the sensitive and weighty matter of Church discipline. He seems to imply that if a member were to be disciplined according to Biblical instructions, how would we know who was the Church that the unrepentant person would be brought before? First of all, it would be great if that would actually happen. Secondly, why would it be impossible to know who were the believers in your group? Perhaps his church is huge and they don't know everyone by sight and can't be aware of how they've lived their lives and that's why? Last of all, why would it be disastrous for a non-Christian to witness that? If the answer to that last question is that they might object or be disruptive, wouldn't that clue you into their status?

His second strand is that excommunication exists. Big deal. When you are removed from one church, you just join another church.

The third and fourth strands are related: believers are to submit to their leaders and shepherds are to care for their flock. I don't get the point on these two. It seems that I have known, and been known by, the last two pastors that I've had because they were friends of relatives of mine, so we were introduced personally. I never know all of the elders, however. If I needed shepherding, it would be from a stranger. As far as submission goes, I don't have a problem with that; if the leadership wants to do a certain thing or go a certain direction, I'm fine with it as long as it matches up with scripture. How would having gone through a membership procedure, or not, make that any different?

The last strand is the one you mentioned, Seth. I agree that having churches set up with members exclusive to each one is dividing up the body rather than unifying it.

Sorry that I got so wordy. I have a lot of time on my hands this week.
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:

User avatar
_Homer
Posts: 639
Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2005 11:43 pm
Location: Brownsville

Post by _Homer » Thu Jul 17, 2008 10:07 am

Piper did a much better job justifying church membership than I expected. Previously, I had thought that the only reason justifying a formal membership role was a legal (secular) one. If the church owns property, as most do, it seems there must be a recognized group who can vote and thus control the property. Years ago we heard of a church with no formal membership role that lost their property to a cult that infiltrated into the congregation and took over.

Piper got me thinking about a particular scripture he did not mention:

1 Timothy 5:9 (New American Standard Bible)

9. A widow is to be put on the list only if she is not less than sixty years old, having been the wife of one man,


It seems reasonable to conclude that they may have also kept a formal list, in at least some cases, of who was a member of the assembly. Perhaps a record of who was baptized; those knowledgeable about the early church have noted that no unbaptized person was considered to be in the church, and as Piper noted, that continues to be followed today.
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:
A Berean

User avatar
_Michelle
Posts: 379
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 9:59 am
Location: SoCal

Post by _Michelle » Thu Jul 17, 2008 10:20 am

Ah, see? I knew there would be a scripture with a list!

Okay, so this list is about which widows would be honored and perhaps supported by the church. The requirements for being on that list were pretty stringent (I'm on my way there, but I'm not old enough and still have a son living at home.) Do you think that this is a template for a list of church membership?

Homer, a few months ago you started a thread titled Is Failure to Attend "Church" a Sin?. To be honest, I never quite figured out your stance on that. You said that you were raised believing it was a sin, quoted the scriptures used to make that case, and asked other posters to weigh in. After that, you never came back with any rebuttal or agreement, so I'm assuming, until you say otherwise, that you still do believe that church attendance is mandatory and failure to attend is a sin. If that's true, do you also believe that church membership is also mandatory?
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:

_Murf
Posts: 25
Joined: Thu Apr 27, 2006 9:17 pm
Location: Dallas

Post by _Murf » Thu Jul 17, 2008 11:03 am

I think you will find scriptual support for
1) Fellowship with believers
2) Recognizing your a part of the body of Christ

If being a member of church helps with these to things great. If you can get these two things without being a member great.
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:

User avatar
_Paidion
Posts: 944
Joined: Mon Jul 25, 2005 7:42 pm
Location: Chapple, Ontario

Post by _Paidion » Thu Jul 17, 2008 3:46 pm

This is the way church membership worked in the beginning:

Now all who believed were together, and had all things in common, and sold their possessions and goods, and divided them among all, as anyone had need.

So continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, they ate their food with gladness and simplicity of heart, praising God and having favor with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily those who were being saved.
Acts 2:44-47 NKJV


You can join clubs and organizations. But the Church of Christ is not an organization, but an organism. You can't join it. The Lord joins you to it.

Any "church" which requires you to join it, and puts your name on a membership roll, does not represent the organic Church of Christ. Rather it represents a man-made organization or part of a man-made organization.

If God has not added you to the Church of Christ, you are not a Christian.

A true local Church is one which expresses the One Church of Christ (therre is no other). That Church will recognize other members, not ask them to join anything. If you join a local "church", you have done nothing more than join a local club. A true expression of the only, true, universal Church will never ask you to join it.

So, to answer the initial question of this thread, "How important is Church membership?" It is all important! If you are not a member of the CHURCH, you are not a member of Christ, for the CHURCH is His Body.
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:
Paidion
Avatar --- Age 45
"Not one soul will ever be redeemed from hell but by being saved from his sins, from the evil in him." --- George MacDonald

User avatar
_Seth
Posts: 59
Joined: Thu Aug 31, 2006 4:36 pm
Location: Hillsboro, OR

Post by _Seth » Fri Jul 18, 2008 11:39 am

Great comments from everybody. Paidion, I particularly appreciated your take on it, as it articulated the way I feel about the matter, but with actual eloquence.
Paidion wrote:If God has not added you to the Church of Christ, you are not a Christian.
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:

User avatar
_Homer
Posts: 639
Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2005 11:43 pm
Location: Brownsville

Post by _Homer » Sat Jul 19, 2008 11:53 pm

Michelle,

You wrote,
Homer, a few months ago you started a thread titled Is Failure to Attend "Church" a Sin?. To be honest, I never quite figured out your stance on that. You said that you were raised believing it was a sin, quoted the scriptures used to make that case, and asked other posters to weigh in. After that, you never came back with any rebuttal or agreement, so I'm assuming, until you say otherwise, that you still do believe that church attendance is mandatory and failure to attend is a sin. If that's true, do you also believe that church membership is also mandatory?
I apologize for not getting back to you sooner; been busy.

I think some have made church attendance a legal thing, and used the passage in Hebrews 10 in that way. I do not take a legalistic view of the matter, but can honestly say it is extremely rare for us not to be there every Sunday morning, even when we are travelling. I do believe it may be a sin not to be there. The passage in Hebrews regarding "not forsaking the assembly" is based on mutual benefit; we are not there merely for what we can get out of it, but to serve one another.

I believe any time we are out of step with God's will for us, it is sin. The question then is this: where does God want me to be on Sunday morning? Perhaps we can not know for sure, but the passage in Hebrews provides a strong hint.

Regarding church membership, before I read Piper's article, I took what might be described as a utilitarian view of church membership. Now he has challenged me to rethink this; perhaps there are spiritual reasons for it. I would like to hear (well, read) more discussion about it.
Last edited by Guest on Wed Dec 31, 1969 7:00 pm, edited 0 times in total.
Reason:
A Berean

Post Reply

Return to “General”