Question re Tongues

SteveF

Re: Question re Tongues

Post by SteveF » Fri Jun 25, 2010 12:31 pm

Homer wrote:TK,

I do not think a case can be made for "praying in the Spirit" and "praying in tongues" being the same thing. Consider what Paul wrote:

Ephesians 6:18 (New King James Version)
18. praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, being watchful to this end with all perseverance and supplication for all the saints—


Watchful here is agrupneo meaning "intent on a thing, alert, perceptive" which hardly fits prayer where you do not understand what you are saying. How would you know you were praying for anyone?
Hi Homer, I think you may be overstating your case when you say no case can be made. I definitely think a case could be made. I, like Rick, think this Jude 20 is not likely referring to tongues exclusively, but I don’t think you can categorically exclude it. In fact it seems quite natural to include tongues as a form of praying in the spirit. When someone is praying in tongues is it not the Spirit that’s directly involved just like in other forms of prayer? In addition, Paul used a similar phrase when he said “pray with my spirit” in reference to tongues.

1Co 14:15 What am I to do? I will pray with my spirit, but I will pray with my mind also; I will sing praise with my spirit, but I will sing with my mind also.

I must assume the Holy Spirit would be involved with Paul's spirit when he prayed in tongues. I don’t see any disconnect between different forms of prayer. There is only one Spirit.

I can also say, along with Rick, that I know numerous people who prayed in tongues, along with groanings, for other people and their prayers were answered. They may or may not have known exactly what they were praying for but they knew for sure that they were praying in the spirit for that individual. In fact, I’ve heard several stories from people I know who were praying in tongues and groanings for someone and the prayers were answered at the exact moment they were praying, even though they were in different locations.

My friend was praying for someone in this manner once. He didn’t know the needs of the person he was praying for but discerned he was going through a deep struggle. Days later when he met up with this person he found out that he had indeed been going through a deep struggle. He also found out that at the exact time he was burdened to pray for him the struggling brother received a revelation of God’s love for him in a manner that he’d never experienced before and was freed from his struggle.

Here’s an even more remarkable story. A lady I know (who does not attend a Charismatic church nor is sensationalistic …) was burdened to pray for another lady who had a ministry in a city about 6 hours from where she lived. She was burdened for her and prayed in tongues and groanings. She sensed this lady was under spiritual attack and she prayed until the burden was lifted. She didn’t know exactly what she was praying but simply knew she was praying for her.

3 days later she was driving home from work she sensed that God didn’t want her to get off at her normal exit on the highway. She continued on for several miles until she reached an exit to a small town. She felt God was telling her to get off at that exit. Then she saw a small restaurant and felt God was telling her to go into that restaurant. After the waitress seated her she couldn’t help but overhear the conversion at the table behind her. After a few minutes it dawned on her that the lady she prayed for 3 days ago was sitting at the table right behind her! (Remember, the lady lived more than 6 hours away in Montreal and they had never met before)

She introduced herself and explained that she had prayed her. The lady then shared that she was indeed under intense spiritual attack at the exact time she was praying and was freed of the attack.

I share all this to illustrate that one can certainly be watchful with this form of prayer.

Steve

SteveF

Re: Question re Tongues

Post by SteveF » Fri Jun 25, 2010 12:40 pm

SamIam wrote:
I take this to mean that you consider your experience (and thus your judgement) as the ultimate authority in evaluating this phenomenon
I would definitely place objective scripture above experience but I do think experience can have a place. For example, I was excited when I read the following scriptures early in my Christian walk. They immediately resonated with me.

Jer 31:33 …….I will put my law within them, and I will write it on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

Joh 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

2Co 3:3 And you show that you are a letter from Christ delivered by us, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts.

Eze 36:26 And I will give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you. And I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh.


The reason these scriptures immediately resonated with me is because they matched my experience. I’ve since met scores of others who testify to the same experience after becoming a Christian. Should experience exclusively dictate how we understand scripture? No. But it should not be surprising when we find our experience reflected in scripture. It is a living faith after all. My experience definitely played a part in how I saw these scriptures. Hence, I think it can play a part in understanding certain scriptures.

Steve

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