Self-Esteem....

[Guest]

I have in the past few years wondered about self-esteem and it's place in the life of the Christian.

Merriam-Websters diction defines self-esteem as a confidence and satisfaction in oneself : SELF-RESPECT or SELF-CONCEIT. Self-Respect is a proper respect for oneself as a human being or a regard for one's own standing or position. Self-conceit is an exaggerated opinion of one's own qualities or abilities : VANITY.

Know when we hear self-esteem talked about in the public arena it is spoken of as having a healthy view of one's self. Examples could be not looking at yourself as ugly and worth nothing but to view yourself as beautiful and worth something.

Biblically speaking we are to deny self, be humble, think of others as more important and all that.

When did self become so important?

[Guest]

When did self become so important?

As a former teacher, I once got roped into the self-esteem bandwagon.
Later, I saw the folly. It is now my opinion that if we teach children self-esteem, and succeed, we have created a lot of arrogant, self-serving monsters.

Did any of the apostles teach self-esteem? Paul taught quite the opposite:

Philippians 2:3 Let nothing be done through selfish ambition or conceit, but in lowliness of mind let each esteem others better than himself. (NKJV)

[Guest]

Don't you think we should be able to think well of ourselves at least in the sense God said we are fearfully and wonderfully made?

I used to have alot of trouble feeling worthy of anything in my life at one time. And the scriptures that reffered to God not making mistakes etc. spoke to my heart and eventually healed me.

I am sorry I am not really good at pulling up scripture I have learned it in my heart but not my head well by recalling their numbers and what book of Gods word they are from. I have MS and it has damaged that area of my brain. Its very sweet though how the Lord impresses His word on my heart when I read it and my memory is there vs my head most of the time.

So I do what I can, apply it how I can and He meets me there.

We have such a wonderful, loving, kind and compassionate God! Glow

[Guest]

Dear Glow,

You wrote, “Don't you think we should be able to think well of ourselves at least in the sense God said we are fearfully and wonderfully made? “

I agree with your rhetorical question with one caveat. When I consider the passage you cite, Psalm 139:14, I note that David’s praiseworthy thoughts are because of a character trait of God he is focused on. David is acknowledging the “marvelous are thy works” nature of God’s works as evident by how God has expressed these marvelous works, i.e. man is fearfully and wonderfully made. I think there is an important and subtle distinction that should be clearly developed here.

Man is tempted to see how “fearfully and wonderfully made” he obviously is and run with that as an end in and of itself. David sees this obvious and glorious condition as something to revel in only because God himself has given this to man. This is to say that David affirms the obvious “I am wonderful” because you (God) are wonderful. The self esteem movement (the world) often communicates, “I am wonderful” because “I am wonderful”. How short sighted, crass, and demeaning to both God and man.


Look carefully at Psalm 139:14. “I will praise thee; for I am fearfully and wonderfully made: marvelous are thy works; and that my soul knoweth right well.” KJV

I never get the impression from this passage, or any other passage, that might be called upon to bolster a claim to positive self worth, self esteem, etc. that man is ever worthy of self esteem apart from his creator. Contrast this biblical view of self with the self esteem industry. There you have a pull yourself up by your bootstraps, mind over matter, the force of one’s will alone, effort(s) to change ones circumstances, destiny, and feelings. To what end; to glorify oneself or one’s creator? I am fearfully and wonderfully made to be an autonomous creature to do what I desire or I am fearfully and wonderfully made as a result of God doing so to communicate his attributes to me.

On a personal note, I am a financial analyst, and am called on to develop some very complicated, sophisticated, detailed, models that take hundreds of hours to develop. How tragic it would be for me to say, “Look how fearfully and wonderfully made my program is”. True, I did write it and it is doing some really neat stuff. But as a believer I would much rather say “I glory in my accomplishments because every good and perfect gift comes from him, including a well exercised mind that can do the tasks I find given to me to do. Thanks Lord.”

I as well have worked through as you put it, “used to have a lot of trouble feeling worthy of anything in my life at one time”. What has brought much understanding, healing, victory, growth, to me over the years is understanding God’s teaching on things.

Consider for a moment MT19:19 Honor thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.

Jesus does not even attempt to develop the idea that a person might not love him or herself. It’s a given of human nature itself that we do already love ourselves. So what is the big deal with self esteem? I would argue that for Christians, Jesus would have us love ourselves under his Lordship with proper biblical healthy love of oneself (call it self esteem if you like) and forsake the worldly model. A love of one’s self characterized by selfish, impure motives, pride, and other deadly motivations is unbecoming for Christians at best, shameful at worst.


Phil 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ. Loving one’s self as God would have it is surly part of his continuing good work in our lives.

[Guest]

excellently put, Dave. amen!

TK

[Guest]

I do not think that we can take it as a matter of course that people love themselves (especially in the way we should understand true love). In the present world, there is a common pastoral need to help people recognize their inherent value and worth. Recognition of true worth is a natural wellspring of true love.

I affirm that this should be articulated in relationship with God, and I do appreciate the dangers of preaching self-esteem without concern for fairly identifying what is estimable about the self.

Shalom,
Emmet

[Guest]

Dave,

Very good post!

You said:

But as a believer I would much rather say “I glory in my accomplishments because every good and perfect gift comes from him, including a well exercised mind that can do the tasks I find given to me to do. Thanks Lord.”

I have long believed it is not correct to refer to anyone as an "overacheiver", as though through their own efforts they performed beyond what God had given the ability to accomplish. To me, there is no place for pride no matter what we accomplish, only thankfulness for what God has enabled us to do.

[Guest]

Everyone loves himself by nature. Consider that almost all unregenerate people are self-serving. Oh, they may occasionally help a neighbour, spend a few dollars on the poor, or do other kind deeds. Is some (not all) cases, even this is self-serving, to make themselves look good. But the vast majority of their effort is spent on themselves. That is also the case with many so-called Christians.

Even when a person states that she hates herself, she may actually be declaring self-love. For example, consider a woman who says, "Oh, I'm so ugly, I hate myself." If she really hated herself, she would be glad she is ugly! What she really means is that she hates being ugly, because she loves herself.

"The heart is deceitful above all things."

[Guest]

Hi

I think its great we can all share our knowledge, opinions etc. on this site. I am getting the feeling tho, maybe some of you have taken (Dvogel88 etc)what I said, different than my intentions. I am not saying the love or acceptance I have for myself is "apart" from God. Or people will recieve it "apart" form God.

I am saying I can love myself because of God. He first loved me and as I continue to understand him better in my certainly "less than perfect self". I am able to embrace what he sees as good in me (the good from him directly).

I am not sepertating myself from Him and just thinking now, "gee I'm wonderfully made so I can feel good about myself regardless of what I do.
I also assume when I write on this site, basic truth we have about the Lord is known by most of you so I personally don't feel comfortable taking up alot of space with written words I believe you already know. I assume, you know how to balance it out with other scripture etc.with my main point, otherwise I would add alot more scripture that would support what I am trying to say etc. for sake of time etc.

I may be making a mistake not doing that, or maybe it is just a difference of the way men and women communicate. But I hope you would know, I don't consider myself as the "world" does in regards of self esteem and how to get it" from the world, though I still struggle with the worlds ways.

I try to pass where to really "get it" on to my kids ands others I see struggling. The world has such a hold on folks and wants to destroy them. I try to help them know it is a natural struggle and only true love and acceptance can come through our father, nowhere else as gently as I can..

I love me because I believe the Lord wants me to and I was created on some levels in his image ( I think He loves himself), I hate me sometimes because I have that human trait , including sin,and the world supports me hating myself or puffing myself up.

I am not sure of the opinion of me you gleaned, or maybe where you feel I am "off the mark" in your comments back to me directly. But I am comfortable with the knowledge I have and the teaching of the Holy spirit I feel blessed I have recieved so far regarding this.

Folks the Lord puts in my path I believe I have been able to share this "outlook"with also take it in and reach closer to their maker in my opnion. And that is where I like to see it finally sit, their self esteem...between them and Him.. Thanks for listening/reading this.I hope I cleared up any misconceptions to any of you I may have brought about... Peace to you. Glow

[Guest]

Hello, Paidion,

Thank you for your posting.

Everyone loves himself by nature. Consider that almost all unregenerate people are self-serving. ... Even when a person states that she hates herself, she may actually be declaring self-love. For example, consider a woman who says, "Oh, I'm so ugly, I hate myself." If she really hated herself, she would be glad she is ugly! What she really means is that she hates being ugly, because she loves herself.

Such examples do not suffice to demonstrate universal self-love. It is possible to be self-serving without being self-loving, just as it is possible to serve another person without loving them. Also, a person who truly loves does not hate on the basis of appearance. Love seeks the welfare of the beloved and celebrates the beloved. There are many persons whose self-involvement does not rise to these benchmarks.

Shalom,
Emmet