Bob wrote:
You've consistently refused to interact with the texts you quote or with the actual content of my arguments. So be it.
Well, I've tried to address your argument, although i am not entirely sure if I understand it at this point. Sometimes you seem to say that prayer doesnt make a difference (in affecting God) and then you say that prayer DOES make a difference. Perhaps it is because i am getting your theology of prayer in soundbites, as it were, rather than all at once.
I am not sure what you mean by "interacting" with the texts I quote. I guess I could list here all the scripture references where Jesus talks about prayer or where people pray and something happens as a result, but that would be kind of boring. Here is one, though, from Dan. 9:
Then I set my face toward the Lord God to make request by prayer and supplications, with fasting, sackcloth, and ashes. And I prayed to the LORD my God, and made confession, and said, “O Lord, great and awesome God, who keeps His covenant and mercy with those who love Him, and with those who keep His commandments.....
Now while I was speaking, praying, and confessing my sin and the sin of my people Israel, and presenting my supplication before the LORD my God for the holy mountain of my God, yes, while I was speaking in prayer, the man Gabriel, whom I had seen in the vision at the beginning, being caused to fly swiftly, reached me about the time of the evening offering. And he informed me, and talked with me, and said, “O Daniel, I have now come forth to give you skill to understand. At the beginning of your supplications the command went out, and I have come to tell you, for you are greatly beloved; therefore consider the matter, and understand the vision
Then, in Dan. 10:
In the third year of Cyrus king of Persia a message was revealed to Daniel, whose name was called Belteshazzar. The message was true, but the appointed time was long;[a] and he understood the message, and had understanding of the vision. 2 In those days I, Daniel, was mourning three full weeks. 3 I ate no pleasant food, no meat or wine came into my mouth, nor did I anoint myself at all, till three whole weeks were fulfilled.
****
Suddenly, a hand touched me, which made me tremble on my knees and on the palms of my hands. And he said to me, “O Daniel, man greatly beloved, understand the words that I speak to you, and stand upright, for I have now been sent to you.” While he was speaking this word to me, I stood trembling. Then he said to me, “Do not fear, Daniel, for from the first day that you set your heart to understand, and to humble yourself before your God, your words were heard; and I have come because of your words. But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me twenty-one days; and behold, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me, for I had been left alone there with the kings of Persia.
The only way I can interact with these texts, particularly the underlined portions, is to simply believe what it says. God sent the angel because Daniel prayed. If Daniel had not prayed, God would not have sent the Angel. Of course that is only my opinion.
We have a fundamental difference in how we view prayer; I'm okay with that, and I am not bitter at all. I just can't imagine having a system of belief where God doesnt really answer prayer; we are just tricked into thinking that He does.
TK
