What exactly happened in the fall?

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_schoel
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Post by _schoel » Wed Aug 29, 2007 8:22 am

**Sorry, this kinda digresses from the topic**
Seth wrote: Oh, and yes, Christopher, it's covered by Lewis...love the first two books of that series. The third one...not so much.
Interesting. I just read Lewis' space trilogy for the first time recently.
While I found the first 2 books great, the third I found riveting. I simply couldn't put it down.

I chatted with some friends who had also read this series and they felt similarly to yourself = loved the first 2, ho-hum with the third.

Maybe I should start a thread about the space trilogy...

Weird.

Dave
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_TK
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Post by _TK » Wed Aug 29, 2007 12:24 pm

i happened to be looking at a CS lewis site that has a forum and they were discussing whether perelandra would make a good movie. the consensus was that it would be difficult because full nudity was an essential element to the story. someone suggested using "pixels" to cover body parts but that might get irritating.

TK
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"Were not our hearts burning within us? (Lk 24:32)

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_Seth
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Post by _Seth » Wed Aug 29, 2007 1:12 pm

There are some books that should never be made into movies. Perelandra is one of them, because the prose is so vivid, it wouldn't transfer well to the silver screen. It'd blow up all my mental images, and that's unacceptable.

You might guess, Perelandra is one of my five favorite books of all time (BTW, there's at least ten books with that distinction).
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_TK
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Post by _TK » Wed Aug 29, 2007 1:52 pm

there is a new movie out based on one of my favorites from younger days - "the dark is rising" by susan cooper; from what i have seen from the trailer they have absolutely ruined it.

you are right seth, perelandra should not be to put to the screen- i suppose we each have our images of what the weird vegetation and the floating land masses look like.

TK
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"Were not our hearts burning within us? (Lk 24:32)

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_Paidion
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Post by _Paidion » Wed Aug 29, 2007 8:12 pm

Schoel:
Interesting. I just read Lewis' space trilogy for the first time recently.
While I found the first 2 books great, the third I found riveting. I simply couldn't put it down.
I'm right with you there, Schoel!!!
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Paidion
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"Not one soul will ever be redeemed from hell but by being saved from his sins, from the evil in him." --- George MacDonald

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_CFChristian
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WOW

Post by _CFChristian » Thu Sep 06, 2007 4:38 am

Seth wrote:I don't subscribe to the idea that anything but humans were affected by the fall. So I'd say that mosquitoes always preyed on humans, but we didn't develop the nice little allergy to their saliva until after the fall.

I always go back to this question: if God had created life on other planets, would it have been affected by Adam's sin?
Wow read Romans Chapter 8 (ALL OF CREATION)
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2 Corinthians 5:10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

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_Seth
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Post by _Seth » Thu Sep 06, 2007 11:10 am

Wow...I read it. It's far from clear that he's talking about that "futility" referring to death. Paul didn't exactly elaborate on the point. There's no clear teaching (to me, anyway) that something physical happened to the whole universe in the Fall. To man, perhaps, but not to anything else.
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_CFChristian
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2X WOW

Post by _CFChristian » Thu Sep 06, 2007 1:28 pm

Seth wrote:Wow...I read it. It's far from clear that he's talking about that "futility" referring to death. Paul didn't exactly elaborate on the point. There's no clear teaching (to me, anyway) that something physical happened to the whole universe in the Fall. To man, perhaps, but not to anything else.
Jer 11:4-11
4 How long shall the land mourn, and the herbs of every field wither, for the wickedness of them that dwell therein? the beasts are consumed, and the birds; because they said, He will not see our last end.
5 If thou hast run with the footmen, and they have wearied thee, then how canst thou contend with horses? and if in the land of peace, in which thou hast trusted, they wearied thee, then how wilt thou do in the swelling of Jordan?
6 For even thy brethren, and the house of thy father, even they have dealt treacherously with thee; yes, they have called a multitude after thee: believe them not, though they speak fair words to thee.
7 ¶ I have forsaken my house, I have left my heritage; I have given the dearly beloved of my soul into the hand of her enemies.
8 My heritage is to me as a lion in the forest; it crieth out against me: therefore have I hated it.
9 My heritage is to me as a speckled bird, the birds around are against her; come ye, assemble all the beasts of the field, come to devour.
10 Many pastors have destroyed my vineyard, they have trodden my portion under foot, they have made my pleasant portion a desolate wilderness.
11 They have made it desolate, and being desolate it mourneth to me; the whole land is made desolate, because no man layeth it to heart.

Ge 3:14-19
14 ¶ And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life:
15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.
16 ¶ Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.
17 ¶ And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;
18 Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee;
and thou shalt eat the herb of the field;
19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.
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2 Corinthians 5:10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

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_darin-houston
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Post by _darin-houston » Fri Jul 11, 2008 8:13 am

Steve wrote:Perhaps you are correct. I do not know how one view or the other impacts us practically.
A Catholic friend has tried to explain their need for infant baptism based on such distinctions. They argue that without infant baptism, you haven't dealt with original sin and wonder how we deal with the original sin problem for our kids. I personally believe the age of accountability serves that concern, but they don't see it taught in Scripture and have started to even act as though there might be issues of our kids playing together if our son isn't baptised, which I find odd.
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_TK
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Post by _TK » Fri Jul 11, 2008 12:24 pm

darin wrote:
and have started to even act as though there might be issues of our kids playing together if our son isn't baptised, which I find odd.
it may not be that odd, if they really really believe that it's infant baptism or hell (if the child dies). they might simply view you as a very negligent parent (i.e. what kind of parent would let their child go to hell because they aren't baptized?)

TK
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"Were not our hearts burning within us? (Lk 24:32)

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