WHO'S GOT THE GAVEL?

[Guest]

In the Gospel of John 5:22 we read "For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son." Then in Heb 12:23 we read "...and to God the Judge of all..." and also 13:4 "...but the whoremongers and adulterers God will judge." so what is the conclusion?

[Guest]

i guess i conclude that Jesus is God.

TK

[Guest]

TK I understand what you are saying. Why do you think Jesus made that distinction of who judges in John? Why isnt that distinction carried out throughout the rest of the epistels?

[Guest]

It is interesting to note that, right beforehand, Jesus' theme is that "the Son can do nothing of his own accord, but only what he sees the Father doing. For whatever the Father does, that the Son does likewise. For the Father loves the Son and shows him all that he himself is doing. And greater works than these will he show him, so that you may marvel. For as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, so also the Son gives life to whom he will" [vv. 19c-21].

So the comments that the Son only does what he sees the Father doing, followed so closely by an assertion that the Son will do something that the Father does not do - these appear contradictory.


But perhaps we may find some resolution from the Torah?

Numbers 35:24 = "Then the congregation shall judge between the slayer and the revenger of blood according to these judgments."

Here, the people "judge," but in doing so they choose to execute the judgments which God has appointed. So perhaps the distinction intended in John is not that the Father is utterly exempted from the holistic process of judgment, but that he has delegated the execution of his judgments to his viceroy - Jesus - even as he had delegated such responsibility to other humans in the past.


Shlamaa,
Emmet

[Guest]

emmett- i think your interpretation is reasonable and possibly correct- although i am not exactly sure what you mean by "viceroy"-- but only because i cant remember what a viceroy is.

TK

[Guest]

but that he has delegated the execution of his judgments to his viceroy - Jesus - even as he had delegated such responsibility to other humans in the past.


Right Emmet, like when God delegated authority to human judges and Jesus referenced it when he said "ye are gods" in John's gospel. Btw i thought viceroy was a cigerette.

[Guest]

Hi, Steve,

like when God delegated authority to human judges and Jesus referenced it when he said "ye are gods" in John's gospel.

This may undercut the thought that Jesus is God, a bit. If God uses divine language figuratively about his human agents, then perhaps some of the divine language applied to Jesus was also figurative?

But for my part, I think Psalm 82 is either: (1) sarcastically referring to pagan kings as "gods," because numerous Middle Eastern kings pretended to divine status; or (2) directed toward "gods" (i.e., august spiritual beings that in today's diction we might call "angels").

Shlamaa,
Emmet