In discussions at Beliefnet on these Gnostic boards (or forums) I made it clear I was not a Gnostic and that I simply wanted to learn more about it; primarily to learn more about Early Church History and the (early) Gnostics it refuted. I wanted a Gnostic "angle" on these things to compare and contrast with what I knew about Early Church History: e.g., I listened to Hoeller's lecture on Mani (founder of Manicheanism) to learn about Augustine's background.
Stephan Hoeller, I've found, is very interesting to listen to (and one of the funniest people I've ever heard on things we (non-dispensational) "Bible-believers" can legitimately laugh at, as well as on New Agey Stuff). Hoeller is a scholar and, while his religion and mine don't fully "meet"; I was and have been very surprised to find how much "good" he has to say about "evangelicals" and how often he agrees with them (us). His critiques of Dan Brown's book (you know its name, lol), and other popular (new agey) stuff that's floating around "out-there"...are virtually in agreement with what conservative evangelicals say about them. I didn't expect this man to be critical of the New Age and popular atheists of our time (Hoeller's "Battle About God" lecture critiques these atheists)....
I must point out that Hoeller really is a modern-day Gnostic and also Jungian. At times he is very critical of "evangelicals" who he usually equates with "fundamentalists" (though the two are not necessarily the same). Many, but not all, of Hoeller's critiques of "fundamentalists" and/or "evangelicals" need to be heard! (another reason I like this man).
Hoeller correctly rebuts "end times madness" in a few of his (free) lectures, some of which are mp3s, others in Real Player format. Hoeller strangely equates the world-wide charismatic movement to gnosticism (which I don't understand). At the same time, his doing so shows his appreciation for certain camps in Christianity (us) "who at least emphasize experience." That is, as opposed to Sacramental forms of Christianity which sees religious experience as a "thing of the past." To put it another way, Hoeller says that in Sacramentalist Christianity "salvation is already accomplished" (and is experienced thru the sacraments, e.g., infant baptism; an "experience" that one cannot remember and thus, can be, and often is, meaningless).
I've asked on another thread if anyone has heard Hoeller, with no reply. Have any of you?
Of course, Hoeller's Christology is Gnostic and thus, heretical to "Bible-believers." I knew this about Gnostics (ancient and modern) before I ever heard him.
His lecture on "Christ, the Misunderstood Redeemer" reflects Hoeller's Gnostic theology (and also has good observations on Liberal Christianity). While I don't accept Hoeller's Christology; he says things that at least this Bible-believer resonates with. What might that be? I'm not sure how to say it. The fact that the Trinity really is a mystery (though we think we understand it essentially, and do to some extent) is what I'm getting at about Hoeller. It's the mystery of experiencing God that I like about Hoeller's thought (though I don't accept his theology, otherwise).
Hoeller often says (in so many words),
"The Christian says: I believe" (certain doctrines or that salvation is a past thing).
and
"The Gnostic says: I do not have to believe---I know" (know-thyself, that would be, and how "God" fits into Gnostic theology; this saying is patently Jungian...which I am not!!!).
Yet once again, where I resonate with Hoeller's 'main thrust' is that we "Bible-believers" believe---and the Bible itself teaches---that we really must know (experience) God. Hoeller really pushes "knowing"...we Christians advocate "knowing God"...there's a similarity and a difference here. At times, one would think Hoeller is an evangelical. Yet at others, he makes it plain he is not!
And he is not.
Warning: Some Christians would probably be highly offended in hearing Hoeller on the "Demiurge." (Gnostics, Hoeller included, believe the God of the OT is an inferior and cruel god as contrasted to the 'higher' gods...of Gnostic definitions). I, myself, can sift through this as I'm listening to learn (thus, not being offended)....
Much like I (am forced to) sift through "word of faith" and "pretrib rapture" when I go to "Bible-believing" churches!!! WhatEVER,
If Hoeller is a "heretic" and the pretrib rapture is "false"...I trust you get my point. At any rate, I'm curious if any of you have heard Hoeller (click on Web Lectures). I'm not a Gnostic, nor am I really trying to promote Hoeller. But I still think he is worth a listen (so totally hilarious at times; I've listened to him when depressed).
The man's definitely thought provoking, anyway...Thanks,
