I need assistance with a greek word

[Michelle]

Luke 19:13 says, "And he called his ten servants, and delivered them ten pounds, and said unto them, Occupy till I come."

The word translated "occupy" is the greek word pragmateuomai. The English word occupy can mean several things, such as to reside or carry on business in a certain location, to fill up time or space, or, in the military sense, to take control of by force. There is this Word of Faith guy who says that the last meaning, the military meaning, is what Jesus was getting at here. (His point is that armies need MONEY to carry on an occupation, so, of course, the Body of Christ needs tons of MONEY to carry on their occupation of the world.) Is the military meaning implied at all in pragmateuomai?

By the way, I realize that this interpretation is kind of bizarre since this parable COULD be taken to mean that God wants his people to increase their wealth in order to garner His blessing...

[SteveF]

Hi Michelle, I don't know Greek but I couldn't find anything that indicates this word is used in that specific military sense. It only seems to refer to everday affairs.

http://www.searchgodsword.org/lex/grk/v ... umber=4231

It is interesting to note that Strong says this word is based from pragmateia. The word pragmateia is translated "affairs" in the follow verse, which indicates it's something a soldier doesn't engage himself in.

2Ti 2:4 no one serving as a soldier did entangle himself with the affairs of life, that him who did enlist him he may please; YLT

Steve

[Michelle]

Thanks, Steve! That really helps!

[Paidion]

Actually, Strongs, NAS Greek, and Online Bible Greek Lexicon all say that the word is derived from "pragma" (from which we get our English word "pragmatic"). Whereas "pragmateuomai" occurs ONLY in the verse you quoted, "pragma" (Strongs 4229) occurs 11 times:

Matthew 18:19 "Again I say to you, that if two of you agree on earth about anything <4229> that they may ask, it shall be done for them by My Father who is in heaven.
Luke 1:1 Inasmuch as many have undertaken to compile an account of the things <4229> accomplished among us,
Acts 5:4 "While it remained unsold, did it not remain your own? And after it was sold, was it not under your control? Why is it that you have conceived this deed <4229> in your heart? You have not lied to men but to God."
Romans 16:2 that you receive her in the Lord in a manner worthy of the saints, and that you help her in whatever matter <4229> she may have need of you; for she herself has also been a helper of many, and of myself as well.
1 Corinthians 6:1 Does any one of you, when he has a case <4229> against his neighbor, dare to go to law before the unrighteous and not before the saints?
2 Corinthians 7:11 For behold what earnestness this very thing, this godly sorrow, has produced in you: what vindication of yourselves, what indignation, what fear, what longing, what zeal, what avenging of wrong! In everything you demonstrated yourselves to be innocent in the matter <4229>.
1 Thessalonians 4:6 and that no man transgress and defraud his brother in the matter <4229> because the Lord is the avenger in all these things, just as we also told you before and solemnly warned you.
Hebrews 6:18 so that by two unchangeable things <4229> in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have taken refuge would have strong encouragement to take hold of the hope set before us.
Hebrews 10:1 For the Law, since it has only a shadow of the good things to come and not the very form of things <4229>, can never, by the same sacrifices which they offer continually year by year, make perfect those who draw near.
Hebrews 11:1 Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things <4229> not seen.
James 3:16 For where jealousy and selfish ambition exist, there is disorder and every evil thing <4229>.

So the word essentially means "matter" or "thing" or "deed". So based on this, the verb "pragmateuomai", would appear to mean "doing a deed" or "engaging in a matter", or being "pragmatic" about one's actions.

[SteveF]

Actually, Strongs, NAS Greek, and Online Bible Greek Lexicon all say that the word is derived from "pragma" (from which we get our English word "pragmatic").

Yes, you're right. I got it backwords. Strong said pragmateia (2 Tim 2:4) was based from pragmateuomai (Luke 19:13) and not the other way around as I stated.

[Michelle]

Ok, then.

I was wondering if pragma or pragmateuomai had anything to do with the word 'pragmatic'.

Still, none of these words have anything to do with occupying as in what a military force might do, right?

[SteveF]

Still, none of these words have anything to do with occupying as in what a military force might do, right?

Considering the following observations:

1. No Greek scholar seems to link it to a military style occupation

2. The base word Pragma, based on Paidions examples, has no connection to military occupation.

3. Another Greek word based on it specifically states it's something soldiers don't do.

I'd say the burden of proof lies squarely on the Word of Faith teacher.

[Paidion]

I suppose a military force occupying a town could be said to be "doing a deed" or "engaging in a matter." That might be ONE FORM of "pragmateuomai", but only one, and probably not the chief one.

[Michelle]

hmm...you would kind of think there was a Greek word to describe the Roman occupation that was taking place at the time, wouldn't you?