Joshua and the land

[blackheart]

In the book of Joshua it seems that Joshua was successful in winning the entire land promised the Israelite nation prior to his death.
How is it that some say the promise of the land still needs to be fulfilled?

[anochria]

Those who still believe that (which I don't) would probably cite both the fact that there are some passages which seem to indicate that the nation of Israel's borders would one day extend all the way to the river Euphrates (definitely not so at the end of Joshua's campaigns) and also that there are some passages which seem to indicate that Israel would maintain their physical land forever, or at least ultimately, in the end.

I see references to the Land in the OT as only initally literal but more fully symbolic of the "kingdom of God" throughout the earth.

[blackheart]

Joshua 11:23 So Joshua took the whole land, according to all that the LORD said unto Moses; and Joshua gave it for an inheritance unto Israel according to their divisions by their tribes. And the land rested from war. (KJV)

Where are the passages that define Gods promises of extending the borders beyond what Joshua conquered?

[alaskazimm]

In Gen 15:18 God makes the land covenant with Abraham with the borders of the land extending from the Euphrates to Egypt

Gen 15:18 That day the LORD made a covenant with Abram: "To your descendants I give this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the Euphrates River —
(NET)

Two verses that speak of the land being possessed:
Jos 21:43 So the LORD gave Israel all the land he had solemnly promised to their ancestors, and they conquered it and lived in it.
Jos 21:44 The LORD made them secure, in fulfillment of all he had solemnly promised their ancestors. None of their enemies could resist them.
Jos 21:45 Not one of the LORD's faithful promises to the family of Israel was left unfulfilled; every one was realized. (NET)

and

1Ki 4:21 Solomon ruled all the kingdoms from the Euphrates River to the land of the Philistines, as far as the border of Egypt. These kingdoms paid tribute as Solomon's subjects throughout his lifetime. (NET)

*edit to say that I don't know of any expansion of the land promised between the promise to Abraham, the conquering of Joshua and the reign of Soloman.

[kaufmannphillips]

(1) Would the Abrahamic promise have to equate in totality to the Israelite promise? Could some of Abraham's other descendants be occupying territory between Israel and the Euphrates?

(2) The Kings reference does not explicitly mention the Euphrates in the Hebrew text, though the epithet "the river" might be taken as indicative of the Euphrates.

[blackheart]

What is the "Israelite" promise?

[kaufmannphillips]

kaufmannphillips wrote:
Would the Abrahamic promise have to equate in totality to the Israelite promise? Could some of Abraham's other descendants be occupying territory between Israel and the Euphrates?

blackheart wrote:
What is the "Israelite" promise?

Whatever one might deem promised to the nation of Israel in particular (if anything). Does the entirety of the Abrahamic promise concerning the land have to be fulfilled in Israel?

[blackheart]

I guess I took the promise to Abraham Isaac and Jacob too literally - I s'pose most anyone can claim the "Israelite" promise!
What a lot o' fun that would be - O wait - that is what is going on now on the east side of the Mediterranean
Now - isn't that fun!!!

[kaufmannphillips]

blackheart wrote:
I guess I took the promise to Abraham Isaac and Jacob too literally - I s'pose most anyone can claim the "Israelite" promise!

Like, say, millions of gentile Christians?

[steve7150]

Two verses that speak of the land being possessed:
Jos 21:43 So the LORD gave Israel all the land he had solemnly promised to their ancestors, and they conquered it and lived in it.
Jos 21:44 The LORD made them secure, in fulfillment of all he had solemnly promised their ancestors. None of their enemies could resist them.
Jos 21:45 Not one of the LORD's faithful promises to the family of Israel was left unfulfilled; every one was realized. (NET)



Isn't this confirming the land promise made to Israel as decendents of Abraham? What am i missing?